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[Music]

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this hope radio for the masses Atlanta

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before July 8 1947

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the Army Air Force has announced that

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applying their - found under now in the

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possession of the army the game is

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rigged change the game changer I

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occasionally think how quickly our

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differences worldwide would vanish if we

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were facing an alien threat from outside

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[Applause]

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fade to black with your host Jimmy

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church on the game-changer Radio Network

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I need your help to do the

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eighty-five

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[Music]

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you are listening to fade to black with

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Jimmy judge on the game change in that

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word

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welcome fade to black

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the masses

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how you doing how you doing how you

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doing

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September 27 2018

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[Music]

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273 days into the new year just 92 days

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left as always we are live from a bunker

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somewhere in the middle of beautiful

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Burbank California and I would like to

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welcome everybody listening all around

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the world all across the United States

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hither and thither to and fro back and

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forth up and down east and west north

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and south far and near

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this is fade to black for kjc are the

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game changer Network in kg RA the planet

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Armijo stimmy church what is cracking

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everybody how you doing yeah it's gonna

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be one of those nights tonight on the

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show and first off very excited very

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special guest Dean Radin is here finally

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I know I know we're going to be

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discussing for the first time I'm fade

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to black by the way his career the

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science of parapsychology yes we're

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gonna discuss the CIA and Stargate and

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his latest book which is called real

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magic and the links for real magic are

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right there at Jimmy Turks radio calm

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you can go in and check out the book it

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is it's one of those reads it's one of

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those reads and Dean Radin is joining us

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tonight

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first time that we've ever done this in

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that we've gone four straight nights

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this week for shows for amazing guests

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and not to have a Fator night on

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Thursday night which we've been doing

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that for years right and feel strange to

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me but when we have the opportunity to

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to have on a guest like Dean Radin

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everything changes that's it that's it I

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ignore the audience I ignore the fun of

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open lines because we're gonna engage in

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conversation tonight that that I've been

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looking forward to for a very long time

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okay so get ready for that Dean will be

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with us at the bottom of the hour don't

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forget all of our social media stuff is

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right there at Jimmy Church radio calm

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on stellar on stellar calm ons te ll

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eight are.com go and sign up register it

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is the next great social media platform

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built for our community it's right there

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on stellar comm also Twitter okay very

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simple at J Church radio and what you

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want to do follow me at a church

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hashtag f2 B is the sandbox every single

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night I announce it we're gonna go

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through two three four thousand tweets

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on this show with you all right now when

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you hear me say something like that you

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need to go over and check out the

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hashtag f2 b feed it's really that

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simple and you see what goes on there it

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is so cool come over and engage in the

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conversation with all of the other fader

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nots

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hashtag F 2 B now hashtag f 2b Q is fade

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to black questions alright it's that

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simple

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email is Jimmy and Jimmy Church

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radio.com okay now I didn't announce

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this I made a little blurb on Twitter

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about this right before the show but

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some huge breaking news and exclusively

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right now I'm going to do it let's get

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to it to the stars Academy of Arts and

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Science Inc has just released their semi

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annual financial report to the security

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and Securities and Exchange Commission

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that's right the SEC in Washington DC

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you can view the entire report and

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filing at SEC gov now I'm not an

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accountant but I will break down what I

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can for you in just a few minutes the

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report was signed by Tom DeLonge Lewis

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Tomasino James Jim semi van and Harold a

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PUD off signed two days ago on September

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25th okay all right stick around I'll

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break it down for you the best that I

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can in just a few minutes other breaking

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news the University of Central Florida

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is now selling Martian dirt for twenty

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dollars a kilogram plus shipping this is

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not fake news by the way

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the team of UCF

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astrophysicists has developed a

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scientifically based standardized method

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for creating Martian and asteroid soil

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known as simulants that's si Mu Lan TS

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simulants and first off you got to ask

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why well scientists are looking for ways

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to grow food on Mars and need to test

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their techniques on soil that most

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closely resembles the stuff on Mars the

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team already has about 30 pending orders

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including one from Kennedy Space Center

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for a half a ton of the stuff I gotta

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get me I got to get me a kilogram of

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Martian dirt it just sounds like fun

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some Martian mud pies yeah and you can

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get it University of Central Florida

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now also breaking news today a new

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hidden Mayan pyramid has been found

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among thousands of ancient Maya

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structures revealed by new aerial survey

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using lidar by an international team of

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archaeologists in northern Guatemala

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yeah you should see it too it is

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ginormous I'll get the links up over

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here on Twitter during the break and

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also huge breaking news for all of you

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fast food fanatics out there because

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McDonald's announced today that the

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seven classic burgers on its menu are

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now served almost entirely without

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unhealthy additives that means

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everything from a plain hamburger to the

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restaurant signature Big Mac sandwich is

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now available without artificial

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flavoring food coloring or preservatives

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there you go don't forget to subscribe

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to our podcast you can do it just two

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dollars a month and it's there for you

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that are not listening to us live and

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you just you need the podcasts you need

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an app you just need to listen to fade

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to black the next day on the way to work

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because you're sleeping during the show

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I get

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that well you can do it it's just $2.00

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per month we have over 900 archive shows

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right therefore you go to Jimmy Church

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radio.com click on the podcast banner

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you can also become a fader not over in

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our membership section on the site and

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all of that is very simple to do just

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click on it and get what you need to do

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you can get downloadable downloadable

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mp3s without commercials right so you

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can do whatever you want with it you

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know I also get an autographed shirts

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and hats and all that fun stuff become a

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fader not today over in our membership

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section in Jimmy Church radio comm and

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while you're there on our site Jimmy

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Church radio comm visit all of our

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sponsors by clicking on their banners

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that's how this show happens just like

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any other radio program we have sponsors

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we have great sponsors that have been

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with us since the beginning that have

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supported this show it's really that

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simple just click on the banners all the

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promo codes are right there Jimmy Church

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radio comm skip the show crack at happy

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birthday - today meat loaf the one and

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only today is 71 years old

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Gweneth Paltrow today is 46 and not only

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does she make the list because of the

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Royal Tenenbaums and I know you expect

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me to say that but there's a really cool

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movie that she was in a little

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independent sci-fi film called Sky

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Captain and the World of Tomorrow and if

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you've never seen that film go and check

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it out the technology how that film was

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done literally in an apartment at least

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the first versions of it

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it's an incredible film great special

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effects Sky Captain and the World of

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Tomorrow and of course she plays Pepper

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Potts in all of those Marvel films also

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today I've got to say it and I will

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Shaun Cassidy today is 60 on this day in

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history in 1536 Anne Boleyn the second

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wife of King Henry the eighth is

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executed on charges including adultery

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incest and conspiracy against the king

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and here you go here's our fader fact

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are you ready the bumblebee bat is not

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only the world's smallest bat but it's

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also the world's smallest mammal it

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weighs in at only two grams and there's

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your fader fact tonight very special

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guest Dean Radin is here we're gonna

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talk about his new book it is the first

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time he's been on the show but his new

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book is real magic and Dean has always

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been on the forefront of science and the

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mind and we're gonna go through all of

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it tonight right here on

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fade to black now I mentioned earlier

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there's breaking news let me hit my fade

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to black coffee before I get to this

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because it's pretty insane as I

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mentioned at the top of the show to the

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stars Academy of Arts and Science Inc

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has just released their semi annual

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financial report to the Securities and

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Exchange Commission that's right the SEC

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in Washington DC and you can read the

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entire report and filing on SEC gov and

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I also stated that I'm not an accountant

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I'm not but after reading through the

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full report a few things really stick

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out again the report was signed by Tom

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DeLonge Lewis Tomasino

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James Jim semi van and Harold put off

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just two days ago on September 25th now

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the opening of the filing has your basic

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balance sheet and I'll get to that in a

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second

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but when you scroll down you will find a

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section called note two in note two of

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the filing it reads as follows now I

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need you to listen to every word this is

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a direct quote from the report and I

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quote now the accompanying financial

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statements have been prepared on a

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ongoing concern basis which can't

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plates the realization of assets and the

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satisfaction of liabilities in the

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normal course of business the company

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has incurred losses from operations and

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has accumulated a deficit at June 30th

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2018 of 37 million four hundred and

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thirty two thousand dollars these

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factors raise doubt about the company's

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ability to continue as a going concern

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period end quote again I'm not an

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accountant I'm not sure what this really

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says okay I see a debt of thirty seven

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million four hundred thirty two thousand

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dollars and I see the next line that

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says this raises doubt about the

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company's ability to continue as a going

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concern but next the filing opens at the

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top with item one which says and again I

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quote we have continued with our

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business formation tasks including

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operation of the entertainment division

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while progress on program initiatives is

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still pending sufficient funding the

276
00:15:46,470 --> 00:15:42,399
company was able to achieve the

277
00:15:50,179 --> 00:15:46,480
following during interim 2018 number one

278
00:15:53,460 --> 00:15:50,189
launched community of interest website

279
00:15:55,590 --> 00:15:53,470
number two continued ongoing meetings

280
00:15:57,869 --> 00:15:55,600
with potential strategic partners

281
00:15:59,910 --> 00:15:57,879
including discussions with the US

282
00:16:03,179 --> 00:15:59,920
government number three

283
00:16:06,030 --> 00:16:03,189
prepared to launch the atom research

284
00:16:08,100 --> 00:16:06,040
project to investigate materials

285
00:16:12,379 --> 00:16:08,110
relevant to its future plans in

286
00:16:16,410 --> 00:16:12,389
space-time metric engineering st m e

287
00:16:19,879 --> 00:16:16,420
number three officially released novel

288
00:16:25,559 --> 00:16:19,889
poet andersen in darkness and four

289
00:16:30,510 --> 00:16:25,569
closed on 1 million $26,000 of funding

290
00:16:33,160 --> 00:16:30,520
from its regulation a offering

291
00:16:38,110 --> 00:16:33,170
it's this last point that is very

292
00:16:42,280 --> 00:16:38,120
interesting because on the TTS a website

293
00:16:45,550 --> 00:16:42,290
they had a counter showing 2.5 million

294
00:16:48,940 --> 00:16:45,560
dollars raised so far and this number

295
00:16:53,040 --> 00:16:48,950
never changed it just stayed a 2.5

296
00:17:01,210 --> 00:16:53,050
million all year but this filing shows

297
00:17:05,470 --> 00:17:01,220
only 1 million and $26,000 424 now that

298
00:17:10,660 --> 00:17:05,480
ticker the 2.5 million ticker never went

299
00:17:13,660 --> 00:17:10,670
to 2.6 never went to 2.7 ever 122.8 it

300
00:17:18,160 --> 00:17:13,670
started at 2.5 million and stayed there

301
00:17:20,199 --> 00:17:18,170
all year they actually only raised 1

302
00:17:22,569 --> 00:17:20,209
million in twenty six thousand and four

303
00:17:26,530 --> 00:17:22,579
hundred and twenty four dollars that

304
00:17:32,680 --> 00:17:26,540
counter is now missing from the to the

305
00:17:35,230 --> 00:17:32,690
stars website it does show two thousand

306
00:17:38,080 --> 00:17:35,240
five hundred and forty-seven investors

307
00:17:40,230 --> 00:17:38,090
at five dollars per share with the

308
00:17:44,590 --> 00:17:40,240
minimum of two hundred dollars of

309
00:17:48,250 --> 00:17:44,600
investment at that minimum some invested

310
00:17:51,520 --> 00:17:48,260
more for sure it's only five hundred and

311
00:17:54,670 --> 00:17:51,530
nine thousand four hundred dollars and

312
00:17:58,540 --> 00:17:54,680
now we know the real number raised is

313
00:18:01,570 --> 00:17:58,550
only one million and twenty six thousand

314
00:18:04,480 --> 00:18:01,580
dollars so why show two point five

315
00:18:08,050 --> 00:18:04,490
million dollars all year I don't know I

316
00:18:12,640 --> 00:18:08,060
don't have an opinion on that I'm only

317
00:18:16,470 --> 00:18:12,650
stating the facts also directly from the

318
00:18:21,370 --> 00:18:16,480
report you get these following numbers

319
00:18:23,650 --> 00:18:21,380
current assets cash now listen to

320
00:18:28,150 --> 00:18:23,660
everything that I am saying I am quoting

321
00:18:32,080 --> 00:18:28,160
directly from the SEC filing current

322
00:18:34,150 --> 00:18:32,090
assets cash one hundred and twenty nine

323
00:18:38,380 --> 00:18:34,160
thousand five hundred and thirty four

324
00:18:40,510 --> 00:18:38,390
dollars accounts receivable eight

325
00:18:43,610 --> 00:18:40,520
thousand one hundred and eighteen

326
00:18:46,190 --> 00:18:43,620
dollars inventory

327
00:18:49,760 --> 00:18:46,200
114 thousand three hundred and thirty

328
00:18:52,520 --> 00:18:49,770
two dollars other assets one hundred and

329
00:18:58,160 --> 00:18:52,530
sixty two thousand two hundred and three

330
00:19:00,140 --> 00:18:58,170
dollars total current assets four

331
00:19:03,430 --> 00:19:00,150
hundred and fourteen thousand one

332
00:19:07,970 --> 00:19:03,440
hundred and eighty seven dollars

333
00:19:09,680 --> 00:19:07,980
advertising expenses were twenty two

334
00:19:13,130 --> 00:19:09,690
thousand seven hundred and eighty four

335
00:19:15,290 --> 00:19:13,140
dollars in 2017 and one hundred and

336
00:19:17,299 --> 00:19:15,300
fifty eight thousand two hundred and

337
00:19:23,450 --> 00:19:17,309
seventeen dollars for the six months

338
00:19:26,690 --> 00:19:23,460
ended June 30th 2018 the report

339
00:19:30,260 --> 00:19:26,700
continues with the following furniture

340
00:19:31,990 --> 00:19:30,270
and fixtures forty eight thousand one

341
00:19:34,910 --> 00:19:32,000
hundred and thirty seven dollars

342
00:19:36,890 --> 00:19:34,920
machinery and equipment one hundred and

343
00:19:40,419 --> 00:19:36,900
sixty thousand seven hundred and fifty

344
00:19:43,460 --> 00:19:40,429
eight dollars leasehold improvements

345
00:19:45,490 --> 00:19:43,470
three hundred and seventy two thousand

346
00:19:49,760 --> 00:19:45,500
five hundred and thirty seven dollars

347
00:19:54,549 --> 00:19:49,770
total property and equipment through

348
00:20:02,120 --> 00:19:54,559
June 30th 2018 five hundred and eighty

349
00:20:04,910 --> 00:20:02,130
1432 dollars now what about salaries the

350
00:20:07,400 --> 00:20:04,920
only part on the financial statements

351
00:20:10,570 --> 00:20:07,410
where anything is relevant to this it

352
00:20:14,000 --> 00:20:10,580
states general and administrative cost

353
00:20:16,370 --> 00:20:14,010
two hundred and forty six thousand three

354
00:20:19,030 --> 00:20:16,380
hundred and thirty four dollars but

355
00:20:23,690 --> 00:20:19,040
there's a second number sales and

356
00:20:26,780 --> 00:20:23,700
marketing five hundred and ninety four

357
00:20:35,419 --> 00:20:26,790
thousand six hundred and twenty eight

358
00:20:42,250 --> 00:20:35,429
dollars I'm going to continue to very

359
00:20:47,960 --> 00:20:42,260
crucial numbers revenues for 2018

360
00:20:51,230 --> 00:20:47,970
revenues for 2018 are three hundred and

361
00:20:55,210 --> 00:20:51,240
sixty nine thousand five hundred and ten

362
00:21:00,790 --> 00:20:55,220
dollars with gross

363
00:21:03,040 --> 00:21:00,800
profit for 2018 of just one hundred and

364
00:21:10,120 --> 00:21:03,050
thirty three thousand six hundred and

365
00:21:14,170 --> 00:21:10,130
two dollars now this does not make any

366
00:21:16,480 --> 00:21:14,180
sense to me I don't understand much of

367
00:21:19,930 --> 00:21:16,490
this because I'm not an accountant and

368
00:21:23,500 --> 00:21:19,940
I'll say it again before I'm done but

369
00:21:28,360 --> 00:21:23,510
I'll read again the last couple of lines

370
00:21:32,530 --> 00:21:28,370
from note - the company has incurred

371
00:21:38,310 --> 00:21:32,540
losses from operations that has an

372
00:21:41,790 --> 00:21:38,320
accumulated deficit at June 30th 2018 of

373
00:21:45,910 --> 00:21:41,800
37 million four hundred and thirty two

374
00:21:48,850 --> 00:21:45,920
thousand dollars these factors raised

375
00:21:50,980 --> 00:21:48,860
doubt about the company's ability to

376
00:21:56,710 --> 00:21:50,990
continue as a going concern

377
00:22:00,310 --> 00:21:56,720
end quote again I'm not an accountant

378
00:22:03,370 --> 00:22:00,320
but T TSA is a public company

379
00:22:07,780 --> 00:22:03,380
hence this filing with the SEC and

380
00:22:12,360 --> 00:22:07,790
posted on sec.gov where anyone can check

381
00:22:15,400 --> 00:22:12,370
it out for review there will be many

382
00:22:17,980 --> 00:22:15,410
talented eyes on this document through

383
00:22:20,050 --> 00:22:17,990
the days and weeks ahead and maybe

384
00:22:23,020 --> 00:22:20,060
someone out there can make sense of it

385
00:22:28,420 --> 00:22:23,030
all and let's all hope it's not as bad

386
00:22:29,800 --> 00:22:28,430
as it seems but for me my only opinion

387
00:22:31,540 --> 00:22:29,810
is this is nuts

388
00:22:35,710 --> 00:22:31,550
because it doesn't make any sense I

389
00:22:39,820 --> 00:22:35,720
don't know where a 37 million dollar

390
00:22:43,420 --> 00:22:39,830
debt comes from and it just may be some

391
00:22:45,910 --> 00:22:43,430
fancy account speak for something to do

392
00:22:49,110 --> 00:22:45,920
with stock or borrowed money or rich

393
00:22:52,810 --> 00:22:49,120
people talk I really don't have any idea

394
00:22:57,060 --> 00:22:52,820
but one thing is for sure the financial

395
00:23:00,550 --> 00:22:57,070
report is not what I expected to see

396
00:23:04,930 --> 00:23:00,560
there are a lot of concerns about to the

397
00:23:07,820 --> 00:23:04,940
stars Academy Arts & Science Inc and I

398
00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:07,830
understand that today there was a

399
00:23:14,180 --> 00:23:10,890
metallurgy scientific report that was

400
00:23:16,460 --> 00:23:14,190
released I'm still getting through that

401
00:23:19,730 --> 00:23:16,470
there are questions about that too as

402
00:23:21,889 --> 00:23:19,740
well and I'm gonna get to the bottom of

403
00:23:24,980 --> 00:23:21,899
it and I need to bring on some very

404
00:23:27,320 --> 00:23:24,990
talented guests that know about not only

405
00:23:30,620 --> 00:23:27,330
the materials that are tested but how

406
00:23:34,130 --> 00:23:30,630
the testing is done so you can expect

407
00:23:38,330 --> 00:23:34,140
that in the immediate days and weeks

408
00:23:42,440 --> 00:23:38,340
ahead but going back to the shows the

409
00:23:45,700 --> 00:23:42,450
show earlier this week where we had John

410
00:23:49,159 --> 00:23:45,710
Greenwald on where we had this singular

411
00:23:53,360 --> 00:23:49,169
Freedom of Information Act document that

412
00:23:56,269 --> 00:23:53,370
had the final of the only mention of a

413
00:23:59,659 --> 00:23:56,279
tip out there and we got that and we

414
00:24:01,430 --> 00:23:59,669
presented that there have been a list of

415
00:24:04,100 --> 00:24:01,440
questions that I have been talking about

416
00:24:09,220 --> 00:24:04,110
on this show for a very long time and

417
00:24:12,259 --> 00:24:09,230
it's only about the obvious my concern

418
00:24:15,440 --> 00:24:12,269
always always no matter who the guest is

419
00:24:19,250 --> 00:24:15,450
or what we are talking about is the

420
00:24:23,000 --> 00:24:19,260
community that's it it is community

421
00:24:25,009 --> 00:24:23,010
first and that's why this document today

422
00:24:27,590 --> 00:24:25,019
this financial statement from to the

423
00:24:30,799 --> 00:24:27,600
stars was presented here tonight because

424
00:24:33,200 --> 00:24:30,809
I don't know it is news I don't have an

425
00:24:35,389 --> 00:24:33,210
opinion I'm not an accountant I need

426
00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:35,399
everybody else to lay eyes on it and

427
00:24:40,639 --> 00:24:38,490
this community going back to anything

428
00:24:43,430 --> 00:24:40,649
that has been controversial over the

429
00:24:44,210 --> 00:24:43,440
years has been able to figure it out on

430
00:24:46,549 --> 00:24:44,220
their own

431
00:24:48,440 --> 00:24:46,559
there's too many smart people that are

432
00:24:48,860 --> 00:24:48,450
part of this community and it doesn't

433
00:24:51,919 --> 00:24:48,870
matter

434
00:24:54,320 --> 00:24:51,929
what's your area of expertise is it may

435
00:24:57,110 --> 00:24:54,330
be computers it may be photo analysis it

436
00:25:00,950 --> 00:24:57,120
may be history it could be anything it

437
00:25:02,570 --> 00:25:00,960
can be linguistics anything right and

438
00:25:04,850 --> 00:25:02,580
you guys are the best and the brightest

439
00:25:07,639 --> 00:25:04,860
and you are able to go and look at stuff

440
00:25:10,250 --> 00:25:07,649
and figure it out very very quickly and

441
00:25:12,259 --> 00:25:10,260
that's what this show is about and

442
00:25:15,980 --> 00:25:12,269
that's why I presented this tonight and

443
00:25:17,720 --> 00:25:15,990
it is our last show of the week we're

444
00:25:19,000 --> 00:25:17,730
gonna head into the weekend and Monday

445
00:25:21,220 --> 00:25:19,010
is gonna roll around

446
00:25:23,830 --> 00:25:21,230
and we'll be able to regroup and figure

447
00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:23,840
out what is actually going on and that

448
00:25:28,990 --> 00:25:26,570
is what is most important here you know

449
00:25:34,810 --> 00:25:29,000
and I want to say one other thing really

450
00:25:36,730 --> 00:25:34,820
quick there are I was sitting and

451
00:25:39,789 --> 00:25:36,740
discussing it doesn't matter with who I

452
00:25:43,390 --> 00:25:39,799
was sitting in discussing yesterday and

453
00:25:46,840 --> 00:25:43,400
today the situations that are going on

454
00:25:49,510 --> 00:25:46,850
all the way around us in every single

455
00:25:52,480 --> 00:25:49,520
segment of our community right now and

456
00:25:54,760 --> 00:25:52,490
it seems like it's a little chaotic and

457
00:25:57,760 --> 00:25:54,770
a little rough and it doesn't matter for

458
00:26:00,850 --> 00:25:57,770
discussing Egypt or lost history

459
00:26:02,620 --> 00:26:00,860
it just doesn't matter and and the

460
00:26:05,950 --> 00:26:02,630
researchers that are involved there or

461
00:26:09,340 --> 00:26:05,960
if it's ufology and if it's to the stars

462
00:26:12,820 --> 00:26:09,350
or if it's other whistleblowers and and

463
00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:12,830
if you yesterday guy and the

464
00:26:18,130 --> 00:26:15,650
trademarking of disclosure and and you

465
00:26:21,250 --> 00:26:18,140
go all the way around from goes to

466
00:26:23,919 --> 00:26:21,260
bigfoot and if you pick a researcher

467
00:26:27,850 --> 00:26:23,929
pick a segment and there is something

468
00:26:30,280 --> 00:26:27,860
going on right now so look it's okay we

469
00:26:32,860 --> 00:26:30,290
have to look at it like this first off

470
00:26:34,659 --> 00:26:32,870
it's exciting right it's exciting we

471
00:26:38,169 --> 00:26:34,669
have breaking news all the way around us

472
00:26:40,960 --> 00:26:38,179
but the second point that I want to make

473
00:26:41,950 --> 00:26:40,970
very clear so all of you can just kick

474
00:26:46,090 --> 00:26:41,960
back and relax

475
00:26:50,250 --> 00:26:46,100
this community is a family and if we

476
00:26:53,230 --> 00:26:50,260
don't have the ability and the fun of

477
00:26:56,049 --> 00:26:53,240
arguing and fighting and figuring stuff

478
00:26:57,330 --> 00:26:56,059
out amongst us then there's no reason to

479
00:27:01,180 --> 00:26:57,340
do any of this

480
00:27:02,320 --> 00:27:01,190
that's what is to be expected it's just

481
00:27:05,560 --> 00:27:02,330
like Thanksgiving

482
00:27:07,299 --> 00:27:05,570
where everything is just blowing up you

483
00:27:10,900 --> 00:27:07,309
know what but you wake up the next day

484
00:27:14,560 --> 00:27:10,910
and we fight another fight that's it and

485
00:27:17,710 --> 00:27:14,570
that's that's what's going on so think

486
00:27:20,380 --> 00:27:17,720
about it okay it's all good

487
00:27:23,289 --> 00:27:20,390
this is fade to black I am your host

488
00:27:26,110 --> 00:27:23,299
Timmy church tonight it's somebody that

489
00:27:28,450 --> 00:27:26,120
I've respected for so many years is

490
00:27:32,350 --> 00:27:28,460
finally here on fade to black and that

491
00:27:34,720 --> 00:27:32,360
is Dean Radin PhD so get ready

492
00:27:37,539 --> 00:27:34,730
when we talk about those exciting

493
00:27:39,909 --> 00:27:37,549
subjects of of quantum mechanics and

494
00:27:42,070 --> 00:27:39,919
quantum theory and the science and

495
00:27:44,980 --> 00:27:42,080
parallel worlds and what is going on at

496
00:27:46,870 --> 00:27:44,990
the atomic and subatomic level and and

497
00:27:50,350 --> 00:27:46,880
how everything is connected and how we

498
00:27:52,389 --> 00:27:50,360
communicate in telepathy and all of

499
00:27:55,450 --> 00:27:52,399
these things right and remote viewing

500
00:27:59,470 --> 00:27:55,460
this is what Dean has been talking about

501
00:28:03,370 --> 00:27:59,480
for decades and science right now is

502
00:28:05,590 --> 00:28:03,380
right on the edge of proving all of

503
00:28:07,090 --> 00:28:05,600
these fantastic subjects that we've been

504
00:28:09,519 --> 00:28:07,100
talking about for all of these years and

505
00:28:11,680 --> 00:28:09,529
tonight we're gonna do that with Dean

506
00:28:13,570 --> 00:28:11,690
Radin I'm very excited about that so get

507
00:28:17,740 --> 00:28:13,580
ready when I come back after this short

508
00:28:21,549 --> 00:28:17,750
break we'll be joined by Dean Radin and

509
00:28:25,960 --> 00:28:21,559
not only not only that but I have asked

510
00:28:27,190 --> 00:28:25,970
Dean to allow me to discuss his career

511
00:28:29,740 --> 00:28:27,200
and his past

512
00:28:31,690 --> 00:28:29,750
the things that brought me to Dean first

513
00:28:34,480 --> 00:28:31,700
so we're gonna do that and then we're

514
00:28:37,419 --> 00:28:34,490
gonna go through it all tonight from

515
00:28:39,159 --> 00:28:37,429
aidid a tizzy I'm yours Jimmy church

516
00:28:42,789 --> 00:28:39,169
this is fade to black you can follow me

517
00:28:45,460 --> 00:28:42,799
on twitter @ JT radio email is Jimmy and

518
00:28:47,320 --> 00:28:45,470
Jimmy church radio calm it's all simple

519
00:29:00,980 --> 00:28:47,330
and I'll be right back with tonight's

520
00:29:13,720 --> 00:29:07,220
[Music]

521
00:29:18,400 --> 00:29:16,210
this is Nicole Church daughter of

522
00:29:20,260 --> 00:29:18,410
you-know-who and you're listening to

523
00:29:25,450 --> 00:29:20,270
fade to black on Jimmy Church radio.com

524
00:29:30,740 --> 00:29:25,460
and the GameChanger network you're

525
00:29:38,220 --> 00:29:34,250
[Music]

526
00:29:47,770 --> 00:29:45,550
GRA radio when you take the beans from

527
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Central America with dashes of

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indonesian and african mixed in and then

529
00:29:55,570 --> 00:29:52,730
roast it to the dark side of fade to

530
00:29:58,750 --> 00:29:55,580
black you create the ultimate brew of

531
00:30:02,500 --> 00:29:58,760
Fringe introducing the fade to black

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blend from River moon coffee yes River

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moons darkest customized roast was

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created for the love of fade to black

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the alchemy of masterful roasting and

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smoking the beans is in every sip of

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this full-bodied dark Java I need my

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coffee dog deep with distinct

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bittersweet chocolate highlights just

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like the bunker leaning further into the

541
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darkness of the roast is fade to black

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00:30:32,770 --> 00:30:31,100
blend from river moon coffee just click

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00:30:36,070 --> 00:30:32,780
on the banner at Jimmy Church radio.com

544
00:30:41,400 --> 00:30:36,080
and use the promo code F to B blend for

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15% off of your order today gobekli tepe

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this is Jimmy church have fade to black

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00:30:49,480 --> 00:30:47,180
and you can get our podcast for just $2

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per month all you have to do is click on

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00:30:55,900 --> 00:30:52,010
the podcast banner over at Jimmy Church

550
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radio.com times are changing the circus

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with life change th get the t.com in a

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561
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565
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566
00:31:37,639 --> 00:31:36,379
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568
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569
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571
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572
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573
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574
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575
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576
00:32:09,530 --> 00:32:07,649
game changer radio network and k gra the

577
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planet

578
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[Music]

579
00:32:16,039 --> 00:32:13,379
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580
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581
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582
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583
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the fast start diet has all the amazing

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benefits of intermittent fasting without

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we've helped thousands of people who

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have struggled to reach their weight

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with the fast start diet you'll lose

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598
00:32:56,899 --> 00:32:54,389
calm and use promo code talk to get 10%

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600
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602
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603
00:33:09,109 --> 00:33:05,970
this is Jimmy Church and whatever your

604
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diet plans are do what I did go to fast

605
00:33:27,280 --> 00:33:38,110
[Music]

606
00:33:42,010 --> 00:33:40,250
welcome back fade to black I'm Hill

607
00:33:45,190 --> 00:33:42,020
Jimmy Church I guess tonight Dean Radin

608
00:33:48,830 --> 00:33:45,200
no fate or night tonight no open lines

609
00:33:52,159 --> 00:33:48,840
it's just another great show now

610
00:33:54,260 --> 00:33:52,169
tonight's we're gonna cover everything

611
00:33:56,840 --> 00:33:54,270
we're gonna do a brief history of magic

612
00:33:59,060 --> 00:33:56,850
come to talk about that we're gonna go

613
00:34:01,730 --> 00:33:59,070
back to ancient history all the way to a

614
00:34:03,560 --> 00:34:01,740
scientific fact today we're gonna review

615
00:34:05,570 --> 00:34:03,570
the scientific evidence for magic a

616
00:34:07,340 --> 00:34:05,580
series of simple but effective magical

617
00:34:09,980 --> 00:34:07,350
techniques and the vision of

618
00:34:12,290 --> 00:34:09,990
scientifically informed magic explaining

619
00:34:15,859 --> 00:34:12,300
why magic will play a key role in the

620
00:34:17,899 --> 00:34:15,869
frontiers of science Dean Radin PhD is

621
00:34:21,379 --> 00:34:17,909
the chief scientist at the Institute of

622
00:34:24,200 --> 00:34:21,389
noetic Sciences ions and before joining

623
00:34:27,230 --> 00:34:24,210
the research staff at ions back in 2001

624
00:34:27,619 --> 00:34:27,240
he had held appointments at AT&T Bell

625
00:34:29,930 --> 00:34:27,629
Labs

626
00:34:32,450 --> 00:34:29,940
so did I I gotta talk to Dean about that

627
00:34:35,450 --> 00:34:32,460
Princeton University University of

628
00:34:37,970 --> 00:34:35,460
Edinburgh and SR I international he is

629
00:34:40,280 --> 00:34:37,980
the author or co-author of over 250

630
00:34:42,530 --> 00:34:40,290
technical and popular articles three

631
00:34:44,089 --> 00:34:42,540
dozen book chapters and three books

632
00:34:46,940 --> 00:34:44,099
including the award-winning the

633
00:34:49,970 --> 00:34:46,950
conscious universe entangled Minds in

634
00:34:52,820 --> 00:34:49,980
the 2014 silver Nautilus Book Award

635
00:34:54,619 --> 00:34:52,830
winner supernormal his latest work is

636
00:34:56,690 --> 00:34:54,629
called of course real magic and the

637
00:34:59,480 --> 00:34:56,700
links are over at Jimmy Church radio.com

638
00:35:02,870 --> 00:34:59,490
that was released back in April of this

639
00:35:04,490 --> 00:35:02,880
year his website is noetic org and I

640
00:35:07,250 --> 00:35:04,500
would like to welcome for the first time

641
00:35:09,859 --> 00:35:07,260
to fade to black Dean Radin Dean good

642
00:35:12,500 --> 00:35:09,869
evening man how are you I'm doing great

643
00:35:13,730 --> 00:35:12,510
Jimmy thanks very much and you know you

644
00:35:15,710 --> 00:35:13,740
know you get the first-time guests

645
00:35:18,950 --> 00:35:15,720
disclaimer Dean's so we got to do that

646
00:35:20,810 --> 00:35:18,960
first - you ready yep okay let's go it's

647
00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:20,820
just you and I sitting on my couch and

648
00:35:24,620 --> 00:35:22,890
having a conversation as friends and

649
00:35:26,720 --> 00:35:24,630
where that conversation starts it starts

650
00:35:28,730 --> 00:35:26,730
where it ends it ends but work Amanda's

651
00:35:29,750 --> 00:35:28,740
friends there you go you're ready to go

652
00:35:32,420 --> 00:35:29,760
sure

653
00:35:35,900 --> 00:35:32,430
now you know what's funny Dean over the

654
00:35:37,940 --> 00:35:35,910
years where I have gone and listened to

655
00:35:42,589 --> 00:35:37,950
your interviews and your presentations

656
00:35:45,140 --> 00:35:42,599
you are so relaxed you know and I'm like

657
00:35:47,599 --> 00:35:45,150
it may be tonight Dean is gonna he's

658
00:35:49,800 --> 00:35:47,609
gonna he's gonna bring it up but you

659
00:35:53,310 --> 00:35:49,810
always stay calm cool and collected

660
00:35:55,260 --> 00:35:53,320
with these very scientific subjects how

661
00:36:00,710 --> 00:35:55,270
do you how do you maintain that

662
00:36:03,180 --> 00:36:00,720
self-control well I suppose it's just

663
00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:03,190
part of the way that I am you see you're

664
00:36:08,400 --> 00:36:06,490
doing it now but it's really true I mean

665
00:36:13,380 --> 00:36:08,410
of course I am I'm quite passionate

666
00:36:15,420 --> 00:36:13,390
about the work that I do but I I don't

667
00:36:18,480 --> 00:36:15,430
know I think it's not that different

668
00:36:21,150 --> 00:36:18,490
among scientists like if you're highly

669
00:36:22,650 --> 00:36:21,160
emotional as a scientist you probably

670
00:36:24,570 --> 00:36:22,660
can't do your job very well

671
00:36:26,430 --> 00:36:24,580
well what about you oh and when you're

672
00:36:29,160 --> 00:36:26,440
hanging out with your scientists buddies

673
00:36:32,510 --> 00:36:29,170
alone and nobody else's around you guys

674
00:36:34,190 --> 00:36:32,520
jump up and down once in a while no no

675
00:36:36,630 --> 00:36:34,200
[Laughter]

676
00:36:39,450 --> 00:36:36,640
and that's what I expect and that's what

677
00:36:42,050 --> 00:36:39,460
I've always seen in you and let's do

678
00:36:45,270 --> 00:36:42,060
this first beef let's let's go back

679
00:36:48,630 --> 00:36:45,280
before ions

680
00:36:52,140 --> 00:36:48,640
you know 2001 let's go way back before

681
00:36:55,890 --> 00:36:52,150
start let's let's go back back and as a

682
00:36:57,930 --> 00:36:55,900
child did you what what attracted you to

683
00:37:00,480 --> 00:36:57,940
this did you have abilities was there

684
00:37:04,860 --> 00:37:00,490
something that trigger did you have an

685
00:37:07,080 --> 00:37:04,870
epiphany that that led you here actually

686
00:37:10,650 --> 00:37:07,090
when I was a child I I don't recall any

687
00:37:13,440 --> 00:37:10,660
psychic experiences that I had nor

688
00:37:16,100 --> 00:37:13,450
anyone in my family who ever even talked

689
00:37:19,020 --> 00:37:16,110
about the subject I grew up in a

690
00:37:23,430 --> 00:37:19,030
non-religious family my religion was

691
00:37:26,400 --> 00:37:23,440
never a topic of discussion so I think

692
00:37:30,180 --> 00:37:26,410
what sparked my interest was science

693
00:37:32,040 --> 00:37:30,190
fiction it's I read all of the science

694
00:37:35,160 --> 00:37:32,050
fiction I could find in a library when I

695
00:37:36,780 --> 00:37:35,170
was in junior high school and when I ran

696
00:37:38,820 --> 00:37:36,790
out of science fiction I read fairy

697
00:37:42,180 --> 00:37:38,830
tales and then I started reading

698
00:37:45,630 --> 00:37:42,190
mythology and basically I read I read a

699
00:37:48,960 --> 00:37:45,640
lot so the thing that struck me even as

700
00:37:53,010 --> 00:37:48,970
a kid was how strange it was in most of

701
00:37:55,680 --> 00:37:53,020
this these genre of books from science

702
00:37:58,170 --> 00:37:55,690
fiction fairy tales and a whole lot it

703
00:38:02,430 --> 00:37:58,180
they took psychic phenomena or at least

704
00:38:03,430 --> 00:38:02,440
special mental powers for granted so it

705
00:38:07,150 --> 00:38:03,440
always I would thought

706
00:38:11,380 --> 00:38:07,160
this is this is strange because if these

707
00:38:14,050 --> 00:38:11,390
stories felt completely outlandish like

708
00:38:16,120 --> 00:38:14,060
it's ridiculous then why do people

709
00:38:17,740 --> 00:38:16,130
gravitate to it because you see it in

710
00:38:21,340 --> 00:38:17,750
fiction everywhere it's been around

711
00:38:24,190 --> 00:38:21,350
forever and so I never forgot that that

712
00:38:27,970 --> 00:38:24,200
the I wonder if this stuff is real and

713
00:38:31,150 --> 00:38:27,980
so you jump 20 to 30 years in the future

714
00:38:33,640 --> 00:38:31,160
and you have tens of millions of fans of

715
00:38:36,670 --> 00:38:33,650
Harry Potter for exactly the same reason

716
00:38:39,130 --> 00:38:36,680
right that these ideas resonate with

717
00:38:41,620 --> 00:38:39,140
people at some level and so lots of

718
00:38:44,260 --> 00:38:41,630
people are curious whether they've had

719
00:38:45,850 --> 00:38:44,270
any psychic experiences or not as to

720
00:38:48,130 --> 00:38:45,860
whether these things might actually be

721
00:38:50,050 --> 00:38:48,140
true or that that's what I was that's

722
00:38:51,340 --> 00:38:50,060
what attracted me and what about like

723
00:38:54,190 --> 00:38:51,350
uri geller

724
00:38:58,510 --> 00:38:54,200
you know who did so much to bring this

725
00:39:02,560 --> 00:38:58,520
into popular culture right and that is a

726
00:39:05,530 --> 00:39:02,570
bona fide part of our society wanting to

727
00:39:07,330 --> 00:39:05,540
believe and and he's presenting it out

728
00:39:10,140 --> 00:39:07,340
there to the masses like that did he

729
00:39:15,700 --> 00:39:10,150
have any effect on you

730
00:39:20,950 --> 00:39:15,710
well I suppose although the moment that

731
00:39:24,160 --> 00:39:20,960
anybody is a performer then there's

732
00:39:26,530 --> 00:39:24,170
always some suspicion because the I've

733
00:39:28,990 --> 00:39:26,540
seen I'd know a lot of mentalists these

734
00:39:30,910 --> 00:39:29,000
are performers who can fake psychic

735
00:39:34,300 --> 00:39:30,920
effects and I have a pretty large

736
00:39:36,850 --> 00:39:34,310
collection of Mentalist tricks sure so I

737
00:39:39,820 --> 00:39:36,860
know how most of them work it's always

738
00:39:42,460 --> 00:39:39,830
possible to be fooled but because most

739
00:39:45,940 --> 00:39:42,470
of the standard tricks are easy to spot

740
00:39:47,320 --> 00:39:45,950
or at least easy to protect against some

741
00:39:50,620 --> 00:39:47,330
of the things that your regular did

742
00:39:52,990 --> 00:39:50,630
could probably be faked so you never

743
00:39:55,480 --> 00:39:53,000
know so this is one of the reasons why

744
00:39:57,910 --> 00:39:55,490
both when people tell me about anecdotes

745
00:39:59,470 --> 00:39:57,920
things that happened to them I listen

746
00:40:01,780 --> 00:39:59,480
because a lot of times is quite

747
00:40:04,420 --> 00:40:01,790
interesting but you but you don't know

748
00:40:06,540 --> 00:40:04,430
what it is you can't know that's why I

749
00:40:08,590 --> 00:40:06,550
always default to go into the laboratory

750
00:40:10,270 --> 00:40:08,600
because there you do have the

751
00:40:13,090 --> 00:40:10,280
possibility of actually knowing what

752
00:40:15,460 --> 00:40:13,100
happened so I put a much more confidence

753
00:40:17,140 --> 00:40:15,470
on laboratory results than I do on

754
00:40:19,539 --> 00:40:17,150
people who perform

755
00:40:20,680 --> 00:40:19,549
amazing things and when you go into the

756
00:40:24,609 --> 00:40:20,690
laboratory

757
00:40:27,490 --> 00:40:24,619
strangely enough you can have an

758
00:40:29,799 --> 00:40:27,500
attitude maybe going in are you going in

759
00:40:32,230 --> 00:40:29,809
maybe as a skeptic as a hardcore

760
00:40:36,819 --> 00:40:32,240
scientist or are you maybe trying to

761
00:40:38,950 --> 00:40:36,829
actually de Bont something well all

762
00:40:40,779 --> 00:40:38,960
science is kept you have to be skeptical

763
00:40:41,380 --> 00:40:40,789
as a scientist otherwise you're not

764
00:40:44,829 --> 00:40:41,390
doing your job

765
00:40:47,799 --> 00:40:44,839
right so you devise a properly

766
00:40:49,930 --> 00:40:47,809
controlled study you have to be more

767
00:40:52,630 --> 00:40:49,940
skeptical than people who label

768
00:40:54,309 --> 00:40:52,640
themselves as skeptics you have to think

769
00:40:58,029 --> 00:40:54,319
of every possible way that somebody

770
00:40:59,349 --> 00:40:58,039
could tear apart the protocol and and

771
00:41:01,210 --> 00:40:59,359
you know that people are going to attack

772
00:41:05,079 --> 00:41:01,220
the studies anyway so you really do have

773
00:41:07,650 --> 00:41:05,089
to second-guess every possible way of of

774
00:41:10,269 --> 00:41:07,660
making sure the study is is tight and

775
00:41:12,190 --> 00:41:10,279
sometimes you'll run a study and you you

776
00:41:13,839 --> 00:41:12,200
discover a flaw or somebody else

777
00:41:16,329 --> 00:41:13,849
discovers a flaw so you have to do it

778
00:41:20,410 --> 00:41:16,339
again so there's lots of iteration to

779
00:41:23,200 --> 00:41:20,420
make sure that you got it right and the

780
00:41:25,720 --> 00:41:23,210
the distinction between proponent and

781
00:41:30,370 --> 00:41:25,730
skeptic is actually kind of a false

782
00:41:32,799 --> 00:41:30,380
equivalency if I sometimes ask to go on

783
00:41:34,990 --> 00:41:32,809
a show where there'll be me and a

784
00:41:37,569 --> 00:41:35,000
so-called skeptic who will have a debate

785
00:41:38,769 --> 00:41:37,579
and I've given up on those I don't do

786
00:41:41,680 --> 00:41:38,779
those anymore right

787
00:41:44,380 --> 00:41:41,690
and the reason is is that it's not it's

788
00:41:47,620 --> 00:41:44,390
we're not not standing on the same the

789
00:41:51,010 --> 00:41:47,630
same ground that somebody could debate

790
00:41:53,529 --> 00:41:51,020
by saying well I simply don't believe it

791
00:41:54,910 --> 00:41:53,539
well that's not debatable anymore

792
00:41:57,880 --> 00:41:54,920
you can only debate when they're

793
00:42:00,250 --> 00:41:57,890
actually data that you can talk about an

794
00:42:01,900 --> 00:42:00,260
analysis of data and those things but a

795
00:42:03,970 --> 00:42:01,910
lot of the people who are professional

796
00:42:07,269 --> 00:42:03,980
skeptics they don't talk about data they

797
00:42:10,120 --> 00:42:07,279
talk about belief so that's not not

798
00:42:12,730 --> 00:42:10,130
worth my time when you when he went to

799
00:42:14,710 --> 00:42:12,740
college what was your focus there you

800
00:42:16,480 --> 00:42:14,720
know before Bell Labs and you know

801
00:42:18,970 --> 00:42:16,490
Princeton and so forth what did you

802
00:42:21,569 --> 00:42:18,980
study in school well I originally

803
00:42:24,130 --> 00:42:21,579
thought that I would become a musician I

804
00:42:27,630 --> 00:42:24,140
started playing the violin when I was

805
00:42:30,589 --> 00:42:27,640
five and I played in the next 20 years

806
00:42:32,509 --> 00:42:30,599
probably practicing between an hour and

807
00:42:35,690 --> 00:42:32,519
three hours of four hours every day Wow

808
00:42:36,890 --> 00:42:35,700
so I was on a career track to be a

809
00:42:41,329 --> 00:42:36,900
concert violinist

810
00:42:44,200 --> 00:42:41,339
and somewhere during college I realized

811
00:42:47,210 --> 00:42:44,210
that it's really hard to be a musician

812
00:42:49,910 --> 00:42:47,220
no one bothered to tell me that being a

813
00:42:51,259 --> 00:42:49,920
musician means you're an athlete you're

814
00:42:54,049 --> 00:42:51,269
making you're living with your body

815
00:42:56,329 --> 00:42:54,059
essentially and I've never been

816
00:42:58,700 --> 00:42:56,339
particularly strong and you need to be

817
00:43:01,420 --> 00:42:58,710
strong to be a musician especially

818
00:43:04,400 --> 00:43:01,430
professional that's right so I asked

819
00:43:07,039 --> 00:43:04,410
everyone I knew if you're not going to

820
00:43:09,289 --> 00:43:07,049
be a musician what else should you do to

821
00:43:11,690 --> 00:43:09,299
earn a living well a lot of people said

822
00:43:14,150 --> 00:43:11,700
well go into engineering well

823
00:43:16,400 --> 00:43:14,160
fortunately I was also good in math and

824
00:43:18,759 --> 00:43:16,410
in science so I went into electrical

825
00:43:21,589 --> 00:43:18,769
engineering because I like to make stuff

826
00:43:23,269 --> 00:43:21,599
and that that was fun so that turned out

827
00:43:25,219 --> 00:43:23,279
to be well and it was probably the

828
00:43:26,029 --> 00:43:25,229
correct choice that if you can you want

829
00:43:28,640 --> 00:43:26,039
to make a living

830
00:43:31,130 --> 00:43:28,650
become an engineer if you can do it and

831
00:43:33,920 --> 00:43:31,140
so I graduated in electrical engineering

832
00:43:35,989 --> 00:43:33,930
I went on to get a masters in electrical

833
00:43:37,930 --> 00:43:35,999
engineering because at that point I

834
00:43:41,120 --> 00:43:37,940
actually didn't know what I wanted to do

835
00:43:42,979 --> 00:43:41,130
and then I switched into psychology and

836
00:43:47,120 --> 00:43:42,989
got my doctorate and experimental

837
00:43:50,089 --> 00:43:47,130
psychology still not quite sure what I

838
00:43:53,390 --> 00:43:50,099
wanted to do what were you when you went

839
00:43:57,620 --> 00:43:53,400
to Bell Labs a EE or electrical engineer

840
00:44:00,019 --> 00:43:57,630
there no when I graduated with my doctor

841
00:44:01,969 --> 00:44:00,029
in psychology at that point I learned

842
00:44:03,979 --> 00:44:01,979
that there actually is a discipline

843
00:44:05,539 --> 00:44:03,989
where it's very useful to have a

844
00:44:07,819 --> 00:44:05,549
combination of engineering and

845
00:44:10,459 --> 00:44:07,829
psychology namely an engineering

846
00:44:13,910 --> 00:44:10,469
psychologist otherwise known as a human

847
00:44:16,759 --> 00:44:13,920
factors were hired right so I realized

848
00:44:19,160 --> 00:44:16,769
oh I guess I've been trained unbeknownst

849
00:44:21,769 --> 00:44:19,170
to me to be a specialist in

850
00:44:23,150 --> 00:44:21,779
human-computer interaction so that's

851
00:44:26,690 --> 00:44:23,160
that's what I did when I was at Bell

852
00:44:30,140 --> 00:44:26,700
Labs I worked on the human interface to

853
00:44:32,599 --> 00:44:30,150
the very complicated electronic and

854
00:44:35,359 --> 00:44:32,609
computer systems that at the time Rand

855
00:44:39,529 --> 00:44:35,369
ran the bed the Bell System oh really

856
00:44:41,779 --> 00:44:39,539
which labs were you at I was my home

857
00:44:42,880 --> 00:44:41,789
base was in Columbus Ohio but I spent a

858
00:44:45,900 --> 00:44:42,890
fair amount of time

859
00:44:49,720 --> 00:44:45,910
and Illinois and at the various labs

860
00:44:53,380 --> 00:44:49,730
locations in New Jersey I would had a

861
00:44:56,170 --> 00:44:53,390
Bell Labs Indianapolis yes I think I

862
00:44:59,200 --> 00:44:56,180
went there once I went to most of the

863
00:45:04,660 --> 00:44:59,210
labs at least once but mostly it was an

864
00:45:07,330 --> 00:45:04,670
approval and Holmdel those those tubes

865
00:45:11,200 --> 00:45:07,340
yeah important ones wait you know we

866
00:45:15,070 --> 00:45:11,210
were what was we were Bell Labs

867
00:45:16,870 --> 00:45:15,080
Indianapolis it was exciting but it was

868
00:45:19,330 --> 00:45:16,880
it was small compared to what was going

869
00:45:22,090 --> 00:45:19,340
on in New Jersey and in other locations

870
00:45:25,710 --> 00:45:22,100
and and my gig there I was an artist and

871
00:45:29,530 --> 00:45:25,720
I put numbers on keypads for for designs

872
00:45:33,490 --> 00:45:29,540
that was my gig I worked in a photo lab

873
00:45:36,010 --> 00:45:33,500
and and generated graphics but it was it

874
00:45:40,780 --> 00:45:36,020
was fun and I learned the ins and outs

875
00:45:42,400 --> 00:45:40,790
of a keypad design that's for somebody

876
00:45:44,230 --> 00:45:42,410
has to do it you know somebody's got to

877
00:45:46,470 --> 00:45:44,240
do it yes one of the things you learn

878
00:45:49,000 --> 00:45:46,480
and the human factors business is that

879
00:45:51,610 --> 00:45:49,010
everything about machinery that people

880
00:45:55,450 --> 00:45:51,620
interact with somebody at some point is

881
00:45:58,450 --> 00:45:55,460
making a design decision and so to this

882
00:46:00,780 --> 00:45:58,460
day we'll be writing a new car or doing

883
00:46:03,910 --> 00:46:00,790
something with some kind of technology

884
00:46:05,320 --> 00:46:03,920
and can really appreciate when you see a

885
00:46:07,900 --> 00:46:05,330
piece of technology that is well

886
00:46:10,780 --> 00:46:07,910
designed because lots of it is not well

887
00:46:13,330 --> 00:46:10,790
designed now you the other day I was

888
00:46:15,340 --> 00:46:13,340
writing a rental car and thinking well I

889
00:46:17,770 --> 00:46:15,350
can't find how to open the gas

890
00:46:19,630 --> 00:46:17,780
compartment on this car there's like

891
00:46:20,800 --> 00:46:19,640
there's nothing there's nothing that

892
00:46:23,170 --> 00:46:20,810
tells me how to do that

893
00:46:25,540 --> 00:46:23,180
so at the gas station I had to sit and

894
00:46:27,580 --> 00:46:25,550
read the manual for 30 minutes to figure

895
00:46:29,920 --> 00:46:27,590
out how do I open the gas container on

896
00:46:32,170 --> 00:46:29,930
the side of the car well that should not

897
00:46:33,850 --> 00:46:32,180
be the case should be obvious and that

898
00:46:36,850 --> 00:46:33,860
means that somebody failed in the design

899
00:46:39,160 --> 00:46:36,860
yeah it's exactly the appreciation that

900
00:46:41,680 --> 00:46:39,170
I went after I had left Bell Labs into

901
00:46:44,140 --> 00:46:41,690
this day I am always looking at

902
00:46:46,960 --> 00:46:44,150
everything with that same exact set of

903
00:46:49,540 --> 00:46:46,970
eyes you know and it's a constant thing

904
00:46:53,320 --> 00:46:49,550
that I can't get that I can't get away

905
00:46:56,470 --> 00:46:53,330
from every single element of everything

906
00:46:59,140 --> 00:46:56,480
around you was designed by somebody

907
00:47:03,670 --> 00:46:59,150
didn't fall out of the sky it's really

908
00:47:07,300 --> 00:47:03,680
that simple so I'm sure that the

909
00:47:09,880 --> 00:47:07,310
psychology part of your education had a

910
00:47:11,680 --> 00:47:09,890
lot to do with the way that you look at

911
00:47:14,710 --> 00:47:11,690
things so scientifically today because

912
00:47:16,530 --> 00:47:14,720
the engineering degree coupled with all

913
00:47:19,630 --> 00:47:16,540
of this

914
00:47:22,870 --> 00:47:19,640
it's either making things very easy for

915
00:47:25,210 --> 00:47:22,880
you or you can't help yourself but jump

916
00:47:27,640 --> 00:47:25,220
into heavy research on whatever the

917
00:47:31,990 --> 00:47:27,650
subject may be whether it's telekinesis

918
00:47:34,780 --> 00:47:32,000
or or ESP or telepathy well I think to

919
00:47:37,540 --> 00:47:34,790
be effective at at parapsychological

920
00:47:40,120 --> 00:47:37,550
research which is what I focused on now

921
00:47:42,280 --> 00:47:40,130
for almost 40 years it's it's very

922
00:47:44,800 --> 00:47:42,290
useful to have a background that has

923
00:47:46,450 --> 00:47:44,810
some engineering in it so you are able

924
00:47:48,940 --> 00:47:46,460
to deal with technical equipment and

925
00:47:50,410 --> 00:47:48,950
maybe build equipment if you need to the

926
00:47:52,810 --> 00:47:50,420
psychology is very important because

927
00:47:54,940 --> 00:47:52,820
among other things you learn how easy it

928
00:47:57,070 --> 00:47:54,950
is to fool people and to fool yourself

929
00:47:59,160 --> 00:47:57,080
right and at the same time you learn

930
00:48:01,960 --> 00:47:59,170
about experimental protocols and

931
00:48:04,960 --> 00:48:01,970
statistics and how to do experiments how

932
00:48:07,630 --> 00:48:04,970
to interact with people so so all of my

933
00:48:10,300 --> 00:48:07,640
backgrounds seem to come together once I

934
00:48:12,970 --> 00:48:10,310
realize that first of all there was a

935
00:48:14,200 --> 00:48:12,980
discipline called parapsychology but

936
00:48:16,090 --> 00:48:14,210
more importantly that I could actually

937
00:48:19,720 --> 00:48:16,100
make a living doing this kind of

938
00:48:24,310 --> 00:48:19,730
research and now parapsychology just by

939
00:48:25,120 --> 00:48:24,320
definition depending on who you're

940
00:48:28,630 --> 00:48:25,130
talking to

941
00:48:30,760 --> 00:48:28,640
it's either negative crazy you know

942
00:48:32,740 --> 00:48:30,770
tinfoil hat stuff or it's something

943
00:48:35,200 --> 00:48:32,750
that's very exciting and cutting-edge

944
00:48:37,080 --> 00:48:35,210
but that's that's the problem that we

945
00:48:40,960 --> 00:48:37,090
have here just the word itself

946
00:48:42,430 --> 00:48:40,970
parapsychology it causes people to think

947
00:48:42,880 --> 00:48:42,440
in the wrong way what you're talking

948
00:48:46,570 --> 00:48:42,890
about

949
00:48:47,770 --> 00:48:46,580
exactly and so this year and next year

950
00:48:50,980 --> 00:48:47,780
I'm the president of the

951
00:48:53,920 --> 00:48:50,990
parapsychological Association so the PA

952
00:48:56,080 --> 00:48:53,930
as we call it is an elected member of

953
00:48:58,060 --> 00:48:56,090
the American Association for the

954
00:49:00,490 --> 00:48:58,070
Advancement of science the biggest

955
00:49:02,859 --> 00:49:00,500
scientific mainstream scientific

956
00:49:07,320 --> 00:49:02,869
organization in the world and we were

957
00:49:10,900 --> 00:49:07,330
elected by the Council of the triple-a s

958
00:49:14,620 --> 00:49:10,910
back in 1969

959
00:49:16,510 --> 00:49:14,630
because what we do is science we use the

960
00:49:18,550 --> 00:49:16,520
same tools and techniques of science as

961
00:49:21,940 --> 00:49:18,560
every other discipline except we apply

962
00:49:23,500 --> 00:49:21,950
them to psychic phenomena and so when

963
00:49:26,440 --> 00:49:23,510
the the council made their choice they

964
00:49:27,970 --> 00:49:26,450
said well it's true that the topic is

965
00:49:30,940 --> 00:49:27,980
certainly controversial but we have

966
00:49:32,980 --> 00:49:30,950
nothing bad to say about the application

967
00:49:35,170 --> 00:49:32,990
of science to study those kinds of

968
00:49:38,410 --> 00:49:35,180
phenomena that's why we remember the

969
00:49:41,230 --> 00:49:38,420
triple a yes on the other hand a couple

970
00:49:42,760 --> 00:49:41,240
months ago I gave the presidential

971
00:49:44,980 --> 00:49:42,770
address which we do at our annual

972
00:49:46,720 --> 00:49:44,990
conventions and the very first thing I

973
00:49:49,780 --> 00:49:46,730
opened up with is why we need to change

974
00:49:52,750 --> 00:49:49,790
the name and I was able to show that by

975
00:49:55,390 --> 00:49:52,760
if you go to google image means I'm in

976
00:49:58,030 --> 00:49:55,400
parapsychology what you come up with is

977
00:50:01,090 --> 00:49:58,040
basically ghostbusters right right right

978
00:50:03,430 --> 00:50:01,100
right that that is the image that that

979
00:50:06,340 --> 00:50:03,440
the word has become and that is not

980
00:50:07,750 --> 00:50:06,350
serving as well so that what we should

981
00:50:10,620 --> 00:50:07,760
be called is something like the

982
00:50:12,730 --> 00:50:10,630
psychophysics Association because

983
00:50:15,460 --> 00:50:12,740
parapsychology is really about the

984
00:50:18,820 --> 00:50:15,470
relationship between the the psyche the

985
00:50:23,590 --> 00:50:18,830
mind and physics it's the it's the space

986
00:50:25,140 --> 00:50:23,600
in between psyche and physics so that's

987
00:50:27,850 --> 00:50:25,150
what we study

988
00:50:30,520 --> 00:50:27,860
unfortunately psychophysics is already

989
00:50:32,430 --> 00:50:30,530
the name of a discipline and so we can't

990
00:50:35,080 --> 00:50:32,440
use that so coming up with a better name

991
00:50:37,120 --> 00:50:35,090
there's a lot of internal debate about

992
00:50:39,310 --> 00:50:37,130
what we should use and whether we should

993
00:50:41,710 --> 00:50:39,320
change it so I don't know that we ever

994
00:50:44,380 --> 00:50:41,720
will yeah yeah you can't you should be

995
00:50:46,690 --> 00:50:44,390
able to call it just magic that's what

996
00:50:47,410 --> 00:50:46,700
you should be able to do and you can't

997
00:50:49,980 --> 00:50:47,420
do that either

998
00:50:52,450 --> 00:50:49,990
well magic is a placeholder for

999
00:50:54,760 --> 00:50:52,460
something is happening but we don't know

1000
00:50:56,520 --> 00:50:54,770
what to call it yet that's what that's

1001
00:50:59,470 --> 00:50:56,530
what that word is always meant basically

1002
00:51:03,130 --> 00:50:59,480
sounds like parapsychology to me yeah

1003
00:51:05,880 --> 00:51:03,140
yeah it does and let's let's go right

1004
00:51:10,330 --> 00:51:05,890
there before we head towards the break

1005
00:51:13,360 --> 00:51:10,340
because today and I don't want to make

1006
00:51:16,780 --> 00:51:13,370
this complex or long but when I hear you

1007
00:51:18,760 --> 00:51:16,790
talk about the the activity that is

1008
00:51:21,190 --> 00:51:18,770
going on at the atomic level and the

1009
00:51:22,809 --> 00:51:21,200
changes that happen there as subtle as

1010
00:51:27,519 --> 00:51:22,819
they may be

1011
00:51:30,939 --> 00:51:27,529
when when this this change happens

1012
00:51:34,380 --> 00:51:30,949
however it is happening those subtle

1013
00:51:36,819 --> 00:51:34,390
changes are what we would refer to

1014
00:51:40,209 --> 00:51:36,829
mansoni different levels whether it's

1015
00:51:43,659 --> 00:51:40,219
magic or or telepathy or whatever

1016
00:51:45,699 --> 00:51:43,669
telekinesis for instance but this has

1017
00:51:47,469 --> 00:51:45,709
been going on for thousands and

1018
00:51:52,029 --> 00:51:47,479
thousands of years and they have

1019
00:51:56,559 --> 00:51:52,039
recognized that and so take us back a

1020
00:51:59,109 --> 00:51:56,569
few thousand years where they were they

1021
00:52:01,779 --> 00:51:59,119
knew then what we're figuring out now

1022
00:52:04,539 --> 00:52:01,789
scientifically ok

1023
00:52:06,819 --> 00:52:04,549
so before the break we'll we have ten

1024
00:52:08,409 --> 00:52:06,829
minutes to cover 10,000 years yes yes

1025
00:52:12,759 --> 00:52:08,419
yes exactly

1026
00:52:16,049 --> 00:52:12,769
that's more like 50,000 years right so

1027
00:52:18,519 --> 00:52:16,059
you start back with at shamanism so

1028
00:52:20,079 --> 00:52:18,529
roughly 50,000 maybe even a hundred

1029
00:52:22,989 --> 00:52:20,089
thousand years ago they either very

1030
00:52:25,059 --> 00:52:22,999
first humans had lived in tribes

1031
00:52:28,049 --> 00:52:25,069
well the shamans were people who were

1032
00:52:31,390 --> 00:52:28,059
selected because of their special gifts

1033
00:52:34,120 --> 00:52:31,400
primarily their gifts about prophecy

1034
00:52:36,579 --> 00:52:34,130
they were able to forecast if there was

1035
00:52:38,499 --> 00:52:36,589
danger ahead also for their gifts of

1036
00:52:40,599 --> 00:52:38,509
clairvoyance where they're able to tell

1037
00:52:43,239 --> 00:52:40,609
where the the animals would be tomorrow

1038
00:52:46,839 --> 00:52:43,249
for the hunt and for their healing

1039
00:52:48,819 --> 00:52:46,849
ability so the shamans were the first

1040
00:52:50,620 --> 00:52:48,829
psychics basically but there were more

1041
00:52:54,009 --> 00:52:50,630
than that there were warriors the wise

1042
00:52:55,689 --> 00:52:54,019
men healers and so on so we can jump

1043
00:52:57,999 --> 00:52:55,699
from shamanism which is still practiced

1044
00:53:00,909 --> 00:52:58,009
around the world today in many places

1045
00:53:03,909 --> 00:53:00,919
but we can jump from the air to perhaps

1046
00:53:06,130 --> 00:53:03,919
one of the first organized magical

1047
00:53:10,149 --> 00:53:06,140
systems or esoteric systems which was

1048
00:53:12,640 --> 00:53:10,159
Pythagoras and the Greek philosopher he

1049
00:53:15,969 --> 00:53:12,650
had a Mystery School where he talked

1050
00:53:19,539 --> 00:53:15,979
about his alternative view of reality

1051
00:53:22,319 --> 00:53:19,549
and then we go to Plato about 500 years

1052
00:53:25,449 --> 00:53:22,329
later called it was his ideas we call

1053
00:53:28,870 --> 00:53:25,459
neoplatonism and then we find ideas like

1054
00:53:32,169 --> 00:53:28,880
Gnosticism the Kabala Hermeticism these

1055
00:53:36,130 --> 00:53:32,179
are all ancient ideas going back to to

1056
00:53:38,380 --> 00:53:36,140
the 5000 years ago where it was a Cosmo

1057
00:53:41,200 --> 00:53:38,390
ecology a cosmology in the sense that it

1058
00:53:43,720 --> 00:53:41,210
was a way for people to describe the

1059
00:53:48,000 --> 00:53:43,730
nature of reality and how they fit into

1060
00:53:49,840 --> 00:53:48,010
the cosmos so from there from

1061
00:53:52,300 --> 00:53:49,850
Hermeticism we jumped to the Knights

1062
00:53:54,190 --> 00:53:52,310
Templar in the medieval times and

1063
00:53:56,890 --> 00:53:54,200
Knights Templar were a little bit

1064
00:53:58,720 --> 00:53:56,900
unusual back then because most of the

1065
00:54:00,910 --> 00:53:58,730
world was extremely tribal and people

1066
00:54:02,830 --> 00:54:00,920
didn't move around very much but the

1067
00:54:04,870 --> 00:54:02,840
Knights Templar did so they were able to

1068
00:54:07,600 --> 00:54:04,880
go to many different societies mostly

1069
00:54:09,580 --> 00:54:07,610
around Europe and they collected ideas

1070
00:54:11,530 --> 00:54:09,590
and among the ideas that they collected

1071
00:54:13,840 --> 00:54:11,540
were the esoteric ideas namely

1072
00:54:16,900 --> 00:54:13,850
Hermeticism kabbalah Gnosticism and so

1073
00:54:19,330 --> 00:54:16,910
on from there we can jump a couple

1074
00:54:21,010 --> 00:54:19,340
hundred years that the Freemasons who

1075
00:54:23,140 --> 00:54:21,020
were like a modern version of the

1076
00:54:25,900 --> 00:54:23,150
Knights Templar and that they made the

1077
00:54:28,780 --> 00:54:25,910
churches so they had secrets about how

1078
00:54:31,780 --> 00:54:28,790
to do masonry to make these amazing

1079
00:54:33,550 --> 00:54:31,790
Gothic cathedrals because they didn't

1080
00:54:36,670 --> 00:54:33,560
have the equipment we have today and

1081
00:54:38,680 --> 00:54:36,680
they were able to do amazing work so the

1082
00:54:42,970 --> 00:54:38,690
night the Freemasons also collected

1083
00:54:45,490 --> 00:54:42,980
esoteric lore the next big advancement

1084
00:54:47,890 --> 00:54:45,500
was the Rosicrucian 's and for the first

1085
00:54:51,130 --> 00:54:47,900
time somebody who wanted to learn about

1086
00:54:53,740 --> 00:54:51,140
the esoteric traditions were able to

1087
00:54:56,830 --> 00:54:53,750
actually go and join the Rosicrucian 's

1088
00:54:59,320 --> 00:54:56,840
and learn it this is like a radical new

1089
00:55:01,270 --> 00:54:59,330
thing where you could anybody could go

1090
00:55:04,510 --> 00:55:01,280
and learn about this stuff because prior

1091
00:55:07,000 --> 00:55:04,520
to that it was a whole word-of-mouth or

1092
00:55:08,530 --> 00:55:07,010
an oral tradition right so from after

1093
00:55:11,320 --> 00:55:08,540
the Rosicrucians we have things like

1094
00:55:13,630 --> 00:55:11,330
theosophy the order of the Golden Dawn

1095
00:55:16,680 --> 00:55:13,640
which is a resurrection of ancient

1096
00:55:19,930 --> 00:55:16,690
magical practices chaos magic and

1097
00:55:24,150 --> 00:55:19,940
Aleister Crowley a in the 1970s and

1098
00:55:26,290 --> 00:55:24,160
before that we have Mesmer and france

1099
00:55:29,410 --> 00:55:26,300
christian science and new thought

1100
00:55:31,270 --> 00:55:29,420
religions in the united states so all

1101
00:55:33,840 --> 00:55:31,280
through this from shamanism all the way

1102
00:55:36,340 --> 00:55:33,850
up to Harry Potter we have we have a

1103
00:55:37,290 --> 00:55:36,350
continual thread called the esoteric

1104
00:55:41,170 --> 00:55:37,300
traditions

1105
00:55:42,040 --> 00:55:41,180
it's called esoteric because it meant it

1106
00:55:44,560 --> 00:55:42,050
was Sabrosa

1107
00:55:47,740 --> 00:55:44,570
it was suppressed so that it was not

1108
00:55:49,970 --> 00:55:47,750
what people were generally taught and it

1109
00:55:52,070 --> 00:55:49,980
was suppressed primarily initially

1110
00:55:54,320 --> 00:55:52,080
by the church also the the Roman

1111
00:55:56,510 --> 00:55:54,330
Catholic Church which suppressed it

1112
00:55:58,970 --> 00:55:56,520
because not because there was disbelief

1113
00:56:01,310 --> 00:55:58,980
about these ideas but because it was a

1114
00:56:03,920 --> 00:56:01,320
challenge to the church's Authority and

1115
00:56:07,490 --> 00:56:03,930
so that's where the the Inquisition was

1116
00:56:09,590 --> 00:56:07,500
a police force which basically was was

1117
00:56:11,930 --> 00:56:09,600
created to enforce the church's

1118
00:56:15,220 --> 00:56:11,940
Authority and in the process anybody who

1119
00:56:17,840 --> 00:56:15,230
didn't accept the Church doctrine like

1120
00:56:20,000 --> 00:56:17,850
Gnosticism was explicitly against the

1121
00:56:22,130 --> 00:56:20,010
church they hated the church but there

1122
00:56:25,700 --> 00:56:22,140
were Christians exist they followed a

1123
00:56:28,849 --> 00:56:25,710
different idea so all of these these

1124
00:56:30,920 --> 00:56:28,859
ideas from shamanism almost the Harry

1125
00:56:34,520 --> 00:56:30,930
Potter have always been considered

1126
00:56:36,980 --> 00:56:34,530
esoteric as compared to exoteric which

1127
00:56:38,690 --> 00:56:36,990
is above the surface it's like the

1128
00:56:42,590 --> 00:56:38,700
everyday world things that people are

1129
00:56:45,290 --> 00:56:42,600
taught esoteric unfortunately is often

1130
00:56:47,900 --> 00:56:45,300
associated with the word occult which

1131
00:56:50,240 --> 00:56:47,910
has a negative connotation and all that

1132
00:56:53,359 --> 00:56:50,250
occult means is hidden just like

1133
00:56:57,170 --> 00:56:53,369
esoteric means also hidden it's just a

1134
00:57:01,250 --> 00:56:57,180
long long thread of knowledge and wisdom

1135
00:57:03,980 --> 00:57:01,260
that has been pushed away so now that we

1136
00:57:07,609 --> 00:57:03,990
have the internet what used to be an

1137
00:57:10,310 --> 00:57:07,619
extremely secret set of ideas you could

1138
00:57:12,980 --> 00:57:10,320
find any of those books and manuscripts

1139
00:57:15,170 --> 00:57:12,990
and ideas in a matter of 10 seconds by

1140
00:57:17,500 --> 00:57:15,180
going to the right website so it's not

1141
00:57:20,180 --> 00:57:17,510
really esoteric traditions anymore

1142
00:57:22,430 --> 00:57:20,190
they're they're all easily available but

1143
00:57:26,150 --> 00:57:22,440
you have to go you have to know where to

1144
00:57:28,460 --> 00:57:26,160
look and then you can find it the the

1145
00:57:32,090 --> 00:57:28,470
history of all of this the the

1146
00:57:36,590 --> 00:57:32,100
fascinating thing for me dean is that

1147
00:57:39,680 --> 00:57:36,600
the society and individuals could see

1148
00:57:42,290 --> 00:57:39,690
the practice and see something going on

1149
00:57:44,510 --> 00:57:42,300
and know that there's something else to

1150
00:57:48,500 --> 00:57:44,520
the world and that was an obvious thing

1151
00:57:53,000 --> 00:57:48,510
but they considered it magic or maybe

1152
00:57:55,820 --> 00:57:53,010
even something else crazier but it's

1153
00:57:58,849 --> 00:57:55,830
actually science that is going on here

1154
00:58:00,680 --> 00:57:58,859
why why can't we get I know we're

1155
00:58:02,480 --> 00:58:00,690
working on it today but why can't we get

1156
00:58:05,780 --> 00:58:02,490
science

1157
00:58:08,420 --> 00:58:05,790
and the other fringe part of this to

1158
00:58:10,430 --> 00:58:08,430
overlap so we can just start knocking

1159
00:58:12,200 --> 00:58:10,440
these dominoes down and showing

1160
00:58:14,180 --> 00:58:12,210
everybody that that you know there's

1161
00:58:17,180 --> 00:58:14,190
some really beautiful things going on

1162
00:58:21,680 --> 00:58:17,190
out there well and that is exactly the

1163
00:58:22,970 --> 00:58:21,690
segue into my book because yes so I can

1164
00:58:24,950 --> 00:58:22,980
tell you must have read some of it

1165
00:58:27,950 --> 00:58:24,960
because that of course is the entire

1166
00:58:30,260 --> 00:58:27,960
theme of my book real magic how do we

1167
00:58:33,500 --> 00:58:30,270
connect these ancient traditions with

1168
00:58:35,930 --> 00:58:33,510
modern science and I I see at least the

1169
00:58:38,200 --> 00:58:35,940
way that I reason why I wrote the book

1170
00:58:41,030 --> 00:58:38,210
is there is a very very clear connection

1171
00:58:44,200 --> 00:58:41,040
let's take a break right here and when

1172
00:58:46,610 --> 00:58:44,210
we come back I'm gonna discuss Stargate

1173
00:58:49,220 --> 00:58:46,620
let's go there's a lot of science that

1174
00:58:50,990 --> 00:58:49,230
is involved there too as well and and

1175
00:58:54,050 --> 00:58:51,000
and we'll do that and we'll just work

1176
00:58:55,880 --> 00:58:54,060
our way right up to real magic this is

1177
00:58:59,960 --> 00:58:55,890
fade to black our guest tonight Dean

1178
00:59:03,020 --> 00:58:59,970
Radin PhD that's right ion's the chief

1179
00:59:04,430 --> 00:59:03,030
scientific officer for noetic and we'll

1180
00:59:06,020 --> 00:59:04,440
do all of that when we come back i'm

1181
00:59:07,040 --> 00:59:06,030
your signature CH this is fade to black

1182
00:59:21,520 --> 00:59:07,050
stay with us

1183
00:59:25,640 --> 00:59:23,769
[Music]

1184
00:59:27,769 --> 00:59:25,650
this is fade to black

1185
00:59:31,459 --> 00:59:27,779
with Jimmy Church on the game changer

1186
00:59:33,249 --> 00:59:31,469
radio network and kgr a the global radio

1187
00:59:36,559 --> 00:59:33,259
alliance

1188
00:59:39,890 --> 00:59:36,569
this is kera digital broadcasting

1189
00:59:43,069 --> 00:59:39,900
station Salt Lake City Utah Van Buren

1190
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Arkansas folks this is very important

1191
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1192
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1193
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1194
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means this wonderful product won't get

1195
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you high no matter what amount you take

1196
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1197
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tied but you can Google CBD benefits and

1198
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be astounded when you're finished

1199
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reading you'll want to log on to ancient

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1206
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1207
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1208
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1209
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1210
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1211
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1212
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life oil calm have a great day this is

1213
01:00:51,499 --> 01:00:49,289
Ray sobs here repping the planet and

1214
01:00:53,509 --> 01:00:51,509
you're listening to my good friend Jimmy

1215
01:00:56,059 --> 01:00:53,519
Church fade to black

1216
01:01:00,650 --> 01:00:56,069
on the game changer network and the kgr

1217
01:01:02,779 --> 01:01:00,660
a digital broadcast station this is Toby

1218
01:01:15,130 --> 01:01:02,789
Kebbell you're listening to Jimmy Church

1219
01:01:20,650 --> 01:01:18,079
and I'm article where the honey brothers

1220
01:01:24,079 --> 01:01:20,660
and you're listening to Jimmy Church

1221
01:01:26,809 --> 01:01:24,089
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with NGO Prem NGO print is the original

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1224
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1225
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1226
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1227
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scientific research proves the active

1228
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1229
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1230
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1231
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1233
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free eight seven seven eighty two

1234
01:01:54,380 --> 01:01:52,859
seventy two twenty one this is Jimmy

1235
01:01:56,359 --> 01:01:54,390
Church of fade to black and you can

1236
01:01:59,569 --> 01:01:56,369
become an official fade or not by just

1237
01:02:01,099 --> 01:01:59,579
going to our membership section at Jimmy

1238
01:02:03,680 --> 01:02:01,109
Church radio.com

1239
01:02:05,690 --> 01:02:03,690
hey it's grace can we talk about

1240
01:02:08,720 --> 01:02:05,700
something serious for a minute your age

1241
01:02:11,150 --> 01:02:08,730
getting old has its perks but remember

1242
01:02:13,130 --> 01:02:11,160
being a few years younger you know your

1243
01:02:14,960 --> 01:02:13,140
hair was thicker you didn't have so many

1244
01:02:16,910 --> 01:02:14,970
wrinkles that extra weight wasn't

1245
01:02:19,130 --> 01:02:16,920
haunting you and you just felt better

1246
01:02:21,769 --> 01:02:19,140
well we can't turn back the clocks and

1247
01:02:24,109 --> 01:02:21,779
go back 10 or 15 years but you can start

1248
01:02:26,990 --> 01:02:24,119
feeling and looking 10 or 15 years

1249
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younger with nature's youth RSF it's a

1250
01:02:30,620 --> 01:02:28,980
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1251
01:02:32,299 --> 01:02:30,630
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1252
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1253
01:02:36,230 --> 01:02:34,890
imagine sleeping better looking better

1254
01:02:38,779 --> 01:02:36,240
and feeling better

1255
01:02:40,700 --> 01:02:38,789
see how Nature's youth RSF has helped

1256
01:02:43,339 --> 01:02:40,710
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1257
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1258
01:02:46,730 --> 01:02:45,150
imagine how it will feel when your

1259
01:02:49,190 --> 01:02:46,740
family and friends are asking you what

1260
01:02:51,799 --> 01:02:49,200
you did to look so good your secret will

1261
01:02:54,019 --> 01:02:51,809
be nature's youth RSS it's time to start

1262
01:02:56,150 --> 01:02:54,029
looking better and feeling better learn

1263
01:02:58,370 --> 01:02:56,160
more in order your nature's use RSS at

1264
01:03:01,519 --> 01:02:58,380
nature's youth calm that's nature's

1265
01:03:03,589 --> 01:03:01,529
youth calm that's nature's youth calm

1266
01:03:06,319 --> 01:03:03,599
this is Jimmy Church of fade to black

1267
01:03:09,260 --> 01:03:06,329
and I only use night-vision goggles from

1268
01:03:12,109 --> 01:03:09,270
baring optics you can see your very own

1269
01:03:15,460 --> 01:03:12,119
green chrome balls today by clicking on

1270
01:03:17,960 --> 01:03:15,470
their banner at Jimmy Church radio.com

1271
01:03:19,549 --> 01:03:17,970
this is Micah Hank's of the gray lien

1272
01:03:21,859 --> 01:03:19,559
report and you're listening to Jimmy

1273
01:03:24,039 --> 01:03:21,869
church on fade to black across the globe

1274
01:03:27,120 --> 01:03:24,049
on the GameChanger radio network and the

1275
01:03:31,140 --> 01:03:27,130
one and only kg are a radio the planet

1276
01:03:31,460 --> 01:03:31,150
[Music]

1277
01:03:46,670 --> 01:03:31,470
[Applause]

1278
01:03:51,160 --> 01:03:48,980
welcome back faith black I am your host

1279
01:03:53,900 --> 01:03:51,170
Jimmy Church I guess tonight Dean Radin

1280
01:04:00,980 --> 01:03:53,910
chief scientist at the Institute of

1281
01:04:04,750 --> 01:04:00,990
noetic Sciences ions and now this is

1282
01:04:08,690 --> 01:04:04,760
what I want to do Dean

1283
01:04:10,790 --> 01:04:08,700
Stargate comes up on this show probably

1284
01:04:14,570 --> 01:04:10,800
two or three times a week not only from

1285
01:04:16,880 --> 01:04:14,580
guests but from the audience they always

1286
01:04:18,710 --> 01:04:16,890
want to hear about it and I don't know

1287
01:04:21,470 --> 01:04:18,720
if the movie has something to would that

1288
01:04:23,560 --> 01:04:21,480
do as well it's kind of funny but what

1289
01:04:27,200 --> 01:04:23,570
was the Stargate project

1290
01:04:29,660 --> 01:04:27,210
well Stargate was one of the code words

1291
01:04:33,890 --> 01:04:29,670
for a program that lasted for about

1292
01:04:36,380 --> 01:04:33,900
twenty years it when I was on it it was

1293
01:04:39,920 --> 01:04:36,390
actually called grill flame at the time

1294
01:04:44,810 --> 01:04:39,930
mr. Stargate was the last code word so

1295
01:04:50,540 --> 01:04:44,820
it was the government's use of psychic

1296
01:04:52,660 --> 01:04:50,550
espionage primarily it was they they had

1297
01:04:55,940 --> 01:04:52,670
reasons to believe that their expert

1298
01:04:57,440 --> 01:04:55,950
psychics who could see and describe

1299
01:05:00,860 --> 01:04:57,450
things were happening on the other side

1300
01:05:03,830 --> 01:05:00,870
of the planet including things that were

1301
01:05:06,140 --> 01:05:03,840
had not occurred yet so precognitive lee

1302
01:05:08,120 --> 01:05:06,150
and also things that were in buildings

1303
01:05:09,790 --> 01:05:08,130
where it was difficult or even

1304
01:05:14,180 --> 01:05:09,800
impossible to get human intelligence

1305
01:05:16,640 --> 01:05:14,190
inside the building so it was in a sense

1306
01:05:21,190 --> 01:05:16,650
a branch of the intelligence gathering

1307
01:05:23,690 --> 01:05:21,200
world and what years were you involved I

1308
01:05:26,180 --> 01:05:23,700
was at Bell Labs at the time and it took

1309
01:05:29,540 --> 01:05:26,190
a leave of absence for one year so I was

1310
01:05:33,860 --> 01:05:29,550
there for the calendar year 1985 1985 in

1311
01:05:35,690 --> 01:05:33,870
it at that point what was what was your

1312
01:05:38,180 --> 01:05:35,700
involvement did you have talented

1313
01:05:40,670 --> 01:05:38,190
talents that you were exploiting or were

1314
01:05:42,950 --> 01:05:40,680
you there for the science part I was a

1315
01:05:45,890 --> 01:05:42,960
visiting scientist for for the whole

1316
01:05:48,610 --> 01:05:45,900
year I met Ingo Swann and Joan

1317
01:05:52,820 --> 01:05:48,620
mcmoneagle and many others at the time

1318
01:05:56,000 --> 01:05:52,830
my my role was partially to help with

1319
01:05:59,030 --> 01:05:56,010
threat assessment and this is what a lot

1320
01:06:00,200 --> 01:05:59,040
of intelligence is about that you hear

1321
01:06:02,599 --> 01:06:00,210
something about and that

1322
01:06:04,070 --> 01:06:02,609
Cerie who has developed something and

1323
01:06:06,910 --> 01:06:04,080
you want to know whether or not it's

1324
01:06:10,250 --> 01:06:06,920
actually a threat to national security

1325
01:06:13,760 --> 01:06:10,260
so we got documents that have been

1326
01:06:16,540 --> 01:06:13,770
spirited out of the Soviet Union at the

1327
01:06:19,520 --> 01:06:16,550
time or what we used to call Red China

1328
01:06:21,260 --> 01:06:19,530
we would read the documents occasionally

1329
01:06:24,170 --> 01:06:21,270
we would talk to somebody who is

1330
01:06:26,570 --> 01:06:24,180
defecting to the United States and try

1331
01:06:29,510 --> 01:06:26,580
to assess whether or not things that

1332
01:06:31,690 --> 01:06:29,520
were psychic that were being that were

1333
01:06:34,940 --> 01:06:31,700
being talked about in these documents

1334
01:06:36,349 --> 01:06:34,950
whether they were credible or not and in

1335
01:06:39,140 --> 01:06:36,359
some cases we would try to replicate

1336
01:06:42,290 --> 01:06:39,150
things that that we had read about so

1337
01:06:44,900 --> 01:06:42,300
that was a big part of what I did I also

1338
01:06:46,970 --> 01:06:44,910
ran a couple of experiments and he was

1339
01:06:50,770 --> 01:06:46,980
part of my time there too

1340
01:06:52,400 --> 01:06:50,780
to be the program chairman of one of the

1341
01:06:56,270 --> 01:06:52,410
meetings of the parapsychological

1342
01:06:59,120 --> 01:06:56,280
Association how that sounds like the

1343
01:07:01,820 --> 01:06:59,130
most exciting thing one could do I mean

1344
01:07:04,430 --> 01:07:01,830
how exciting was it to be involved even

1345
01:07:07,640 --> 01:07:04,440
though it was just for a short year how

1346
01:07:10,880 --> 01:07:07,650
exciting was it it was mind-boggling

1347
01:07:12,829 --> 01:07:10,890
right it really was there's one of the

1348
01:07:17,690 --> 01:07:12,839
strangest aspects of the whole thing is

1349
01:07:20,660 --> 01:07:17,700
that at the time this was a TS sei

1350
01:07:23,240 --> 01:07:20,670
program it's above top secret that's its

1351
01:07:25,820 --> 01:07:23,250
so-called carve-out program so it's in

1352
01:07:27,109 --> 01:07:25,830
the deep black nobody is allowed to know

1353
01:07:28,910 --> 01:07:27,119
about it even if you have top-secret

1354
01:07:31,940 --> 01:07:28,920
clearance you can't know about it until

1355
01:07:34,190 --> 01:07:31,950
you're read in on the project so you get

1356
01:07:35,690 --> 01:07:34,200
to see this book and you sign it along

1357
01:07:37,970 --> 01:07:35,700
with you can see everybody else who

1358
01:07:40,250 --> 01:07:37,980
signed it and this program is probably

1359
01:07:44,870 --> 01:07:40,260
known by perhaps a hundred people maybe

1360
01:07:47,720 --> 01:07:44,880
120 and in the United States for a long

1361
01:07:50,690 --> 01:07:47,730
time even the code words were classified

1362
01:07:53,359 --> 01:07:50,700
you couldn't say anything about this so

1363
01:07:55,490 --> 01:07:53,369
we'd go into work this would edit suraíh

1364
01:07:57,950 --> 01:07:55,500
and we'd be doing all kinds of

1365
01:08:00,620 --> 01:07:57,960
interesting psychic things and when you

1366
01:08:04,250 --> 01:08:00,630
leave work not only could you not talk

1367
01:08:05,870 --> 01:08:04,260
about it but the prevailing opinion and

1368
01:08:07,700 --> 01:08:05,880
this is still true somewhat today but

1369
01:08:09,829 --> 01:08:07,710
the prevailing opinion among scientists

1370
01:08:13,040 --> 01:08:09,839
at the time was this psychic stuff is

1371
01:08:14,000 --> 01:08:13,050
nonsense it couldn't possibly be true so

1372
01:08:16,300 --> 01:08:14,010
outside the bill

1373
01:08:20,440 --> 01:08:16,310
that's the attitude you had to adopt

1374
01:08:23,090 --> 01:08:20,450
inside the building we were doing it so

1375
01:08:25,729 --> 01:08:23,100
this didn't feel very comfortable to me

1376
01:08:28,329 --> 01:08:25,739
after a while that you needed to become

1377
01:08:30,670 --> 01:08:28,339
kind of a professional schizophrenic

1378
01:08:34,039 --> 01:08:30,680
inside the building you're doing amazing

1379
01:08:35,930 --> 01:08:34,049
futuristic psychic things outside the

1380
01:08:38,510 --> 01:08:35,940
building it's all nonsense

1381
01:08:41,140 --> 01:08:38,520
so that just never said very well with

1382
01:08:46,099 --> 01:08:41,150
me no I can now I can only imagine and

1383
01:08:47,990 --> 01:08:46,109
at that time was who was who was funding

1384
01:08:49,970 --> 01:08:48,000
the program I'm just this is these are

1385
01:08:52,670 --> 01:08:49,980
questions for myself I've got the

1386
01:08:56,599 --> 01:08:52,680
opportunity to ask was it the CIA was it

1387
01:08:58,760 --> 01:08:56,609
an agency or was it the army it was a

1388
01:09:00,200 --> 01:08:58,770
tail end of the DIA and the beginning of

1389
01:09:03,260 --> 01:09:00,210
the army Wow

1390
01:09:07,070 --> 01:09:03,270
how exciting seriously I mean that's

1391
01:09:12,349 --> 01:09:07,080
like a movie and when you're when you're

1392
01:09:15,260 --> 01:09:12,359
hanging out was it was it Ingo and Joe

1393
01:09:18,170 --> 01:09:15,270
were there members of the DIA that were

1394
01:09:21,079 --> 01:09:18,180
monitoring you or were you guys able to

1395
01:09:24,380 --> 01:09:21,089
I mean tell me what that was like was it

1396
01:09:30,380 --> 01:09:24,390
more freeform or were you given

1397
01:09:33,400 --> 01:09:30,390
assignments no it was we had tasks I

1398
01:09:37,360 --> 01:09:33,410
mean some of them were operational tasks

1399
01:09:40,490 --> 01:09:37,370
what I mean by that is that the some

1400
01:09:42,530 --> 01:09:40,500
some client and this is every every

1401
01:09:45,200 --> 01:09:42,540
intelligence agency you've ever heard of

1402
01:09:47,840 --> 01:09:45,210
in many that you have not they would

1403
01:09:51,710 --> 01:09:47,850
repeatedly ask for information about

1404
01:09:54,229 --> 01:09:51,720
some project they were working on one

1405
01:09:56,420 --> 01:09:54,239
example is the Joint Task Force which is

1406
01:09:58,130 --> 01:09:56,430
a combination of many military and

1407
01:10:01,280 --> 01:09:58,140
intelligence agencies who are together

1408
01:10:03,770 --> 01:10:01,290
working on something so one of the most

1409
01:10:05,540 --> 01:10:03,780
frequent requests came from the Joint

1410
01:10:09,350 --> 01:10:05,550
Task Force and they were working on drug

1411
01:10:10,580 --> 01:10:09,360
interdiction so they'd be they knew that

1412
01:10:13,550 --> 01:10:10,590
somebody was going to enter the country

1413
01:10:16,310 --> 01:10:13,560
probably by a boat they had no idea when

1414
01:10:18,950 --> 01:10:16,320
or where they would ask us where they

1415
01:10:21,650 --> 01:10:18,960
would ask the the Army equivalent the

1416
01:10:23,540 --> 01:10:21,660
army group was doing only operational

1417
01:10:25,040 --> 01:10:23,550
missions we would occasionally do

1418
01:10:27,590 --> 01:10:25,050
operational missions but mostly we were

1419
01:10:29,870 --> 01:10:27,600
doing science so occasionally we would

1420
01:10:33,650 --> 01:10:29,880
I would see the operation missions under

1421
01:10:37,160 --> 01:10:33,660
way and we would identify through

1422
01:10:40,700 --> 01:10:37,170
psychic means where we expected a boat

1423
01:10:43,430 --> 01:10:40,710
to enter US waters and it was successful

1424
01:10:45,830 --> 01:10:43,440
enough that the the Joint Task Force

1425
01:10:49,820 --> 01:10:45,840
came back over a hundred times to ask

1426
01:10:51,710 --> 01:10:49,830
for additional information so different

1427
01:10:53,750 --> 01:10:51,720
agencies would use this for different

1428
01:10:56,120 --> 01:10:53,760
reasons and in all cases they would

1429
01:10:58,010 --> 01:10:56,130
never rely only on what we said they

1430
01:10:59,860 --> 01:10:58,020
would use multiple sources of

1431
01:11:03,050 --> 01:10:59,870
information from lots of different

1432
01:11:05,000 --> 01:11:03,060
approaches and then ours would be used

1433
01:11:07,520 --> 01:11:05,010
as a part of the jigsaw puzzle that they

1434
01:11:09,500 --> 01:11:07,530
were putting together but we knew that

1435
01:11:12,890 --> 01:11:09,510
in many cases the information we were

1436
01:11:14,540 --> 01:11:12,900
providing allowed them to fill in the

1437
01:11:16,820 --> 01:11:14,550
rest of the jigsaw puzzle that otherwise

1438
01:11:22,010 --> 01:11:16,830
it would not have been able to do when

1439
01:11:25,100 --> 01:11:22,020
you first got to s RI I'm sure you had a

1440
01:11:27,170 --> 01:11:25,110
certain mindset and we're trying to

1441
01:11:30,350 --> 01:11:27,180
understand these things and and look at

1442
01:11:32,450 --> 01:11:30,360
it but after a year there and you left

1443
01:11:35,090 --> 01:11:32,460
what did you take with you what did you

1444
01:11:38,240 --> 01:11:35,100
learn well the main thing that I learned

1445
01:11:41,140 --> 01:11:38,250
was I really really want to spend my

1446
01:11:44,300 --> 01:11:41,150
career doing this that's what I learned

1447
01:11:47,240 --> 01:11:44,310
because once I mean before that I had

1448
01:11:49,850 --> 01:11:47,250
already been doing experiments have had

1449
01:11:51,560 --> 01:11:49,860
Bell Labs that and in fact that was a

1450
01:11:53,420 --> 01:11:51,570
connection the reason I went to SR I

1451
01:11:54,860 --> 01:11:53,430
it's because I was doing some

1452
01:11:56,480 --> 01:11:54,870
experiments at Bell Labs it got

1453
01:11:59,000 --> 01:11:56,490
permission to talk about them at

1454
01:12:02,450 --> 01:11:59,010
conferences and somebody at a conference

1455
01:12:06,260 --> 01:12:02,460
then recruited me for this for the SLI

1456
01:12:08,540 --> 01:12:06,270
program at that time there were rumors

1457
01:12:10,190 --> 01:12:08,550
that the government was doing something

1458
01:12:11,930 --> 01:12:10,200
but no one actually knew what was going

1459
01:12:14,810 --> 01:12:11,940
on so of course when I got the

1460
01:12:17,210 --> 01:12:14,820
invitation to join this program it's

1461
01:12:19,820 --> 01:12:17,220
like you you can't say no to that if you

1462
01:12:21,800 --> 01:12:19,830
have any interest in it at all right and

1463
01:12:24,590 --> 01:12:21,810
having seen it then from the inside and

1464
01:12:26,950 --> 01:12:24,600
especially seeing people like like Ingo

1465
01:12:30,710 --> 01:12:26,960
and Joe mcmoneagle who are really good

1466
01:12:34,040 --> 01:12:30,720
at what they were able to do and had it

1467
01:12:36,650 --> 01:12:34,050
had nothing it was so opposite from the

1468
01:12:40,010 --> 01:12:36,660
stereotyped vision that people have of

1469
01:12:40,840 --> 01:12:40,020
Madam's zodiac I mean of course unlike

1470
01:12:42,640 --> 01:12:40,850
that at all

1471
01:12:45,690 --> 01:12:42,650
I said these weren't completely normal

1472
01:12:48,430 --> 01:12:45,700
people that had just astounding skills

1473
01:12:49,210 --> 01:12:48,440
how could you how could you walk away

1474
01:12:51,910 --> 01:12:49,220
from that

1475
01:12:53,740 --> 01:12:51,920
well I found I couldn't I really wanted

1476
01:12:55,420 --> 01:12:53,750
to figure out a way of continuing to do

1477
01:12:57,370 --> 01:12:55,430
it but not doing it in a classified

1478
01:12:59,050 --> 01:12:57,380
environment these are so many

1479
01:13:01,270 --> 01:12:59,060
restrictions about what you can do and

1480
01:13:03,250 --> 01:13:01,280
say in those environments that it felt

1481
01:13:08,110 --> 01:13:03,260
too constraining to me well you know and

1482
01:13:08,620 --> 01:13:08,120
I imagine that at some point we all want

1483
01:13:10,900 --> 01:13:08,630
to wear that

1484
01:13:13,150 --> 01:13:10,910
I want to believe shirt right and that's

1485
01:13:16,450 --> 01:13:13,160
where you know you had to have gone

1486
01:13:19,450 --> 01:13:16,460
through that phase was it at s RI where

1487
01:13:22,390 --> 01:13:19,460
you just at one point went you know holy

1488
01:13:25,630 --> 01:13:22,400
crap this is this is real I mean this is

1489
01:13:29,110 --> 01:13:25,640
real real yeah the holy crap moment

1490
01:13:31,660 --> 01:13:29,120
occurred when I got the full briefing on

1491
01:13:34,840 --> 01:13:31,670
the project it took a while to get all

1492
01:13:37,210 --> 01:13:34,850
of the various clearances for the level

1493
01:13:39,340 --> 01:13:37,220
of classification for this project but I

1494
01:13:41,260 --> 01:13:39,350
finally got them and then how put off

1495
01:13:43,450 --> 01:13:41,270
was the head of the program at the time

1496
01:13:44,920 --> 01:13:43,460
and he gave me the briefing so this is

1497
01:13:47,440 --> 01:13:44,930
the briefing briefing that's given to

1498
01:13:51,940 --> 01:13:47,450
members of Congress and so on who need

1499
01:13:54,340 --> 01:13:51,950
to know about the program and much of

1500
01:13:56,830 --> 01:13:54,350
that briefing now is available through

1501
01:13:59,200 --> 01:13:56,840
books because most of the project was

1502
01:14:02,410 --> 01:13:59,210
been Declassified but at the time nobody

1503
01:14:05,410 --> 01:14:02,420
had any idea how accurate remote viewing

1504
01:14:07,440 --> 01:14:05,420
could be and so I see one case after the

1505
01:14:09,670 --> 01:14:07,450
other and real operational emissions

1506
01:14:12,280 --> 01:14:09,680
showing how good it could actually be

1507
01:14:14,380 --> 01:14:12,290
with talented people and it's it's

1508
01:14:16,450 --> 01:14:14,390
mind-boggling I mean it gives you

1509
01:14:18,580 --> 01:14:16,460
vertigo when you first encounter it I

1510
01:14:23,320 --> 01:14:18,590
can only imagine I can only imagine now

1511
01:14:26,410 --> 01:14:23,330
what about your your oaths and security

1512
01:14:29,230 --> 01:14:26,420
clearances and probably an NDA that was

1513
01:14:31,090 --> 01:14:29,240
you know an extended how much of it

1514
01:14:35,230 --> 01:14:31,100
could you talk about when you acted the

1515
01:14:38,650 --> 01:14:35,240
program or you couldn't discuss it at

1516
01:14:40,930 --> 01:14:38,660
all no and I left the program I couldn't

1517
01:14:43,540 --> 01:14:40,940
talk about anything I mean I went back

1518
01:14:46,210 --> 01:14:43,550
to Bell Labs where I returned after the

1519
01:14:48,640 --> 01:14:46,220
leave of absence and all I could tell

1520
01:14:52,570 --> 01:14:48,650
people was I was working at a sore eye I

1521
01:14:54,280 --> 01:14:52,580
couldn't even tell them on what and how

1522
01:14:56,950 --> 01:14:54,290
long how long

1523
01:14:59,820 --> 01:14:56,960
until you were you know given your your

1524
01:15:02,770 --> 01:14:59,830
wings and freedom to discuss things

1525
01:15:04,330 --> 01:15:02,780
actually not until 1995 that's crazy

1526
01:15:06,520 --> 01:15:04,340
yeah yeah when the program was

1527
01:15:09,400 --> 01:15:06,530
Declassified then then I was freer to

1528
01:15:11,590 --> 01:15:09,410
talk about what was going on and what

1529
01:15:15,670 --> 01:15:11,600
happened next you go back to to Bell

1530
01:15:18,400 --> 01:15:15,680
Labs but in in the Paris psychological

1531
01:15:20,290 --> 01:15:18,410
career of yours what happened next well

1532
01:15:22,570 --> 01:15:20,300
when I went back to Bell Labs I was

1533
01:15:24,610 --> 01:15:22,580
determined to figure out a way of

1534
01:15:28,270 --> 01:15:24,620
spending my time doing this kind of

1535
01:15:31,210 --> 01:15:28,280
research right and within about four

1536
01:15:34,630 --> 01:15:31,220
months I was invited to go to Princeton

1537
01:15:37,540 --> 01:15:34,640
to to work alongside the he'd the pear

1538
01:15:41,440 --> 01:15:37,550
lab the the group in the engineering

1539
01:15:44,800 --> 01:15:41,450
building or the Engineering College

1540
01:15:47,350 --> 01:15:44,810
within Princeton with Bob John and

1541
01:15:51,370 --> 01:15:47,360
Brenda Don and they had at that time

1542
01:15:53,410 --> 01:15:51,380
just begun to start the pear lab the

1543
01:15:56,350 --> 01:15:53,420
Princeton Engineering anomalies research

1544
01:15:58,210 --> 01:15:56,360
lab it's not quite sure they have been

1545
01:16:00,910 --> 01:15:58,220
already going for maybe five years by

1546
01:16:05,680 --> 01:16:00,920
that point and I was brought in to as

1547
01:16:07,750 --> 01:16:05,690
part of a large grant that they got to

1548
01:16:10,750 --> 01:16:07,760
be in this psychology department that's

1549
01:16:13,630 --> 01:16:10,760
where my appointment was and I was there

1550
01:16:16,690 --> 01:16:13,640
to create multidisciplinary programs

1551
01:16:19,600 --> 01:16:16,700
that would connect the pear lab with a

1552
01:16:22,030 --> 01:16:19,610
psychology department with social

1553
01:16:24,630 --> 01:16:22,040
psychology and philosophy and computer

1554
01:16:27,910 --> 01:16:24,640
graphics and a few other areas on campus

1555
01:16:32,080 --> 01:16:27,920
but realistically I spent almost all of

1556
01:16:36,010 --> 01:16:32,090
my time doing cyber search along because

1557
01:16:38,410 --> 01:16:36,020
why not what I was interested in was it

1558
01:16:40,720 --> 01:16:38,420
was it at Princeton where you started to

1559
01:16:44,080 --> 01:16:40,730
hone your skills with controlled

1560
01:16:45,210 --> 01:16:44,090
experiments no I was already doing that

1561
01:16:48,850 --> 01:16:45,220
at Bell Labs

1562
01:16:52,090 --> 01:16:48,860
so Princeton was just was a very nice

1563
01:16:53,740 --> 01:16:52,100
place to stay and and to work because I

1564
01:16:56,590 --> 01:16:53,750
was able to see what was going on in the

1565
01:16:58,180 --> 01:16:56,600
pear lab firsthand and I worked pretty

1566
01:17:00,670 --> 01:16:58,190
closely with Roger Nelson who was

1567
01:17:04,210 --> 01:17:00,680
another psychologist in the pear lab for

1568
01:17:07,900 --> 01:17:04,220
for over 20 years how do you how do you

1569
01:17:10,150 --> 01:17:07,910
how do you demonstrate the

1570
01:17:13,990 --> 01:17:10,160
the power of the mind and its control

1571
01:17:16,300 --> 01:17:14,000
over something that is animate how do

1572
01:17:18,790 --> 01:17:16,310
you how do you do that not only for your

1573
01:17:21,790 --> 01:17:18,800
fellow scientists and for yourself but

1574
01:17:25,780 --> 01:17:21,800
for somebody that is completely new to

1575
01:17:29,140 --> 01:17:25,790
this well the the experiments are pretty

1576
01:17:31,260 --> 01:17:29,150
straightforward most experiments

1577
01:17:33,580 --> 01:17:31,270
involving mind matter interaction are

1578
01:17:35,830 --> 01:17:33,590
involve some sort of a target system

1579
01:17:39,610 --> 01:17:35,840
that you're able to monitor carefully

1580
01:17:43,360 --> 01:17:39,620
and it's everything from water as a

1581
01:17:46,720 --> 01:17:43,370
target to bacteria to cell cultures to

1582
01:17:49,480 --> 01:17:46,730
small animal behavior large animal

1583
01:17:52,600 --> 01:17:49,490
behavior human behavior electronic

1584
01:17:54,940 --> 01:17:52,610
circuits the toss of dice on and on and

1585
01:17:57,580 --> 01:17:54,950
on all kinds of physical targets have

1586
01:17:59,920 --> 01:17:57,590
been used some living in some nonliving

1587
01:18:02,920 --> 01:17:59,930
targets and the protocols in most cases

1588
01:18:04,510 --> 01:18:02,930
are approximately the same that you give

1589
01:18:06,760 --> 01:18:04,520
somebody instructions to try to

1590
01:18:09,400 --> 01:18:06,770
influence the target whether it's the

1591
01:18:12,040 --> 01:18:09,410
role of a die or the output of a random

1592
01:18:14,530 --> 01:18:12,050
number generator or where human behavior

1593
01:18:17,260 --> 01:18:14,540
at a distance or even human physiology

1594
01:18:19,750 --> 01:18:17,270
at a distance and then you have periods

1595
01:18:22,900 --> 01:18:19,760
where you withdraw your intention so

1596
01:18:24,700 --> 01:18:22,910
you're trying to intend a change and now

1597
01:18:27,550 --> 01:18:24,710
you're stopping that and you go back and

1598
01:18:30,220 --> 01:18:27,560
forth many times and then you look at

1599
01:18:32,620 --> 01:18:30,230
the recording of the physical system and

1600
01:18:34,270 --> 01:18:32,630
you see whether or not it was car that

1601
01:18:36,250 --> 01:18:34,280
did the behavior in the system was

1602
01:18:40,390 --> 01:18:36,260
corresponding to the mental instructions

1603
01:18:42,520 --> 01:18:40,400
that the person was giving so that's how

1604
01:18:45,460 --> 01:18:42,530
you do it it's always a comparison

1605
01:18:48,280 --> 01:18:45,470
between an intentional control system or

1606
01:18:51,190 --> 01:18:48,290
intentional control instructions and a

1607
01:18:55,600 --> 01:18:51,200
withdrawal of those that intention are

1608
01:18:56,920 --> 01:18:55,610
these repetitive in that you know you're

1609
01:19:00,310 --> 01:18:56,930
mentioning the roll of the dice or

1610
01:19:03,370 --> 01:19:00,320
effects on water or you know germs or

1611
01:19:07,690 --> 01:19:03,380
bacteria are we talking about thousands

1612
01:19:11,290 --> 01:19:07,700
you know how many times do you have to

1613
01:19:13,240 --> 01:19:11,300
establish a pattern well the effects

1614
01:19:16,420 --> 01:19:13,250
that we see in virtually all of these

1615
01:19:19,300 --> 01:19:16,430
systems is very very small so in a

1616
01:19:20,830 --> 01:19:19,310
single session where an individual has

1617
01:19:21,669 --> 01:19:20,840
has to do something it might only be

1618
01:19:23,709 --> 01:19:21,679
taken

1619
01:19:26,830 --> 01:19:23,719
half an hour and over the course of a

1620
01:19:29,229 --> 01:19:26,840
half an hour maybe 40 alternations of

1621
01:19:32,140 --> 01:19:29,239
now concentrate and now relax

1622
01:19:34,359 --> 01:19:32,150
so in a given session you can't ask

1623
01:19:36,640 --> 01:19:34,369
somebody to spend a long long time

1624
01:19:39,429 --> 01:19:36,650
trying to influence something because

1625
01:19:42,580 --> 01:19:39,439
you get you get tired very quickly right

1626
01:19:44,679 --> 01:19:42,590
and your mind begins to wander so you do

1627
01:19:47,379 --> 01:19:44,689
many many sessions with many many people

1628
01:19:49,629 --> 01:19:47,389
and then you use statistics to see

1629
01:19:53,169 --> 01:19:49,639
whether or not the system is behaving

1630
01:19:57,189 --> 01:19:53,179
according to the protocol I wanna ask

1631
01:19:59,080 --> 01:19:57,199
you a probably a strange question but I

1632
01:20:03,250 --> 01:19:59,090
think you'll you'll enjoy it

1633
01:20:05,649 --> 01:20:03,260
I've watched all of those old

1634
01:20:08,709 --> 01:20:05,659
black-and-white films of the Russian

1635
01:20:12,540 --> 01:20:08,719
experiments do you know what I'm talking

1636
01:20:16,779 --> 01:20:12,550
about the movement of objects and stuff

1637
01:20:20,350 --> 01:20:16,789
real or fake as some of it was probably

1638
01:20:24,219 --> 01:20:20,360
real it's not necessarily the case that

1639
01:20:26,140 --> 01:20:24,229
it was psychic though like for example

1640
01:20:27,939 --> 01:20:26,150
in some cases where you see somebody

1641
01:20:30,459 --> 01:20:27,949
straining like crazy like their heads

1642
01:20:32,799 --> 01:20:30,469
going to pop off their hands are quite

1643
01:20:34,600 --> 01:20:32,809
close to the target that you're trying

1644
01:20:37,270 --> 01:20:34,610
to influence that's right and there are

1645
01:20:40,080 --> 01:20:37,280
electrostatic effects there's heat

1646
01:20:44,469 --> 01:20:40,090
convection effects there's all kinds of

1647
01:20:46,089 --> 01:20:44,479
mundane subtle but but real physical

1648
01:20:47,319 --> 01:20:46,099
effects that happen when you bring your

1649
01:20:50,949 --> 01:20:47,329
hands close to something

1650
01:20:53,350 --> 01:20:50,959
electrostatic as I said so so we don't

1651
01:20:55,719 --> 01:20:53,360
know it's only when you do a protocol

1652
01:20:58,109 --> 01:20:55,729
where you're you're either far distant

1653
01:21:00,310 --> 01:20:58,119
from the target so that there's no

1654
01:21:03,009 --> 01:21:00,320
ordinary way that you can interact with

1655
01:21:05,919 --> 01:21:03,019
the system or you're working with a

1656
01:21:07,330 --> 01:21:05,929
system that is so well controlled like

1657
01:21:09,580 --> 01:21:07,340
you could have your hands near it but

1658
01:21:10,929 --> 01:21:09,590
perhaps the targets in a vacuum great in

1659
01:21:13,089 --> 01:21:10,939
which case then they can't be heat

1660
01:21:15,100 --> 01:21:13,099
convection it can't be lots of things

1661
01:21:17,500 --> 01:21:15,110
but you can still be close to it and

1662
01:21:19,870 --> 01:21:17,510
most of the experiments that I do I

1663
01:21:22,000 --> 01:21:19,880
don't try to shield the system so much

1664
01:21:24,459 --> 01:21:22,010
that you can still be closed because

1665
01:21:26,229 --> 01:21:24,469
it's really tough to do that like the

1666
01:21:29,739 --> 01:21:26,239
moment you get near something all kinds

1667
01:21:31,959 --> 01:21:29,749
of things are possible so about the

1668
01:21:34,919 --> 01:21:31,969
closest that anybody can get in any of

1669
01:21:36,689 --> 01:21:34,929
our experiments is about two meters and

1670
01:21:39,209 --> 01:21:36,699
oftentimes we'll do it over the internet

1671
01:21:41,640 --> 01:21:39,219
so people can be kilometers away right

1672
01:21:42,989 --> 01:21:41,650
yeah because I would watch those films I

1673
01:21:47,850 --> 01:21:42,999
don't want to spend any more time on

1674
01:21:49,799 --> 01:21:47,860
this but some of it could be heat some

1675
01:21:54,239 --> 01:21:49,809
of it could be even wind I mean their

1676
01:21:57,089 --> 01:21:54,249
arms are waving you know crazily some of

1677
01:22:01,140 --> 01:21:57,099
the stuff though is under glass and it's

1678
01:22:03,390 --> 01:22:01,150
a bit different and I it I once I

1679
01:22:05,819 --> 01:22:03,400
determined okay all right all right this

1680
01:22:08,790 --> 01:22:05,829
is just whatever but then I would watch

1681
01:22:11,790 --> 01:22:08,800
it's like well wait a minute there's

1682
01:22:13,969 --> 01:22:11,800
something going on here and and I'm not

1683
01:22:16,589 --> 01:22:13,979
sure do you think the Russians

1684
01:22:18,660 --> 01:22:16,599
well first after you do they still

1685
01:22:21,270 --> 01:22:18,670
research this like they were so

1686
01:22:23,040 --> 01:22:21,280
aggressively in the 50s and 60s but do

1687
01:22:26,640 --> 01:22:23,050
you think that they were really close to

1688
01:22:28,799 --> 01:22:26,650
to getting something perfected well the

1689
01:22:31,169 --> 01:22:28,809
Russians had a much bigger program at

1690
01:22:33,299 --> 01:22:31,179
the same time that we did right like

1691
01:22:36,810 --> 01:22:33,309
during the whole Stargate 20 years the

1692
01:22:38,609 --> 01:22:36,820
Russians had a program like 10 times 10

1693
01:22:41,000 --> 01:22:38,619
in terms of the number of people and the

1694
01:22:44,040 --> 01:22:41,010
amount of money from what we know today

1695
01:22:47,000 --> 01:22:44,050
they weren't really ahead of us and

1696
01:22:50,640 --> 01:22:47,010
anyway they did spend a lot more time on

1697
01:22:51,929 --> 01:22:50,650
psychokinetic effects but as best as I

1698
01:22:56,219 --> 01:22:51,939
can tell they did not make any

1699
01:22:58,739 --> 01:22:56,229
breakthroughs that the and went beyond

1700
01:23:00,839 --> 01:22:58,749
anything that we know let's go through

1701
01:23:02,580 --> 01:23:00,849
some quick definitions before the bottom

1702
01:23:06,179 --> 01:23:02,590
of the hour because we're really gonna

1703
01:23:10,049 --> 01:23:06,189
get into the book and and magic and

1704
01:23:13,169 --> 01:23:10,059
science when we come back and let's go

1705
01:23:14,969 --> 01:23:13,179
through this the basics are very simple

1706
01:23:18,359 --> 01:23:14,979
but we're gonna be discussing these like

1707
01:23:21,419 --> 01:23:18,369
ESP telepathy telekinesis remote viewing

1708
01:23:24,390 --> 01:23:21,429
Precog let's start with ESP what's

1709
01:23:26,879 --> 01:23:24,400
what's your definition of ESP well it

1710
01:23:30,600 --> 01:23:26,889
stands for extrasensory perception and

1711
01:23:33,689 --> 01:23:30,610
it was a general term used for being

1712
01:23:38,129 --> 01:23:33,699
able to perceive some sort of target

1713
01:23:41,189 --> 01:23:38,139
that was shielded by distance or time so

1714
01:23:44,009 --> 01:23:41,199
that's that was ESP telepathy even

1715
01:23:45,660 --> 01:23:44,019
though we discuss it a lot I think it's

1716
01:23:46,259 --> 01:23:45,670
also misunderstood what's your

1717
01:23:48,390 --> 01:23:46,269
definition

1718
01:23:52,740 --> 01:23:48,400
telepathy

1719
01:23:54,479 --> 01:23:52,750
and feeling feeling at a distance the

1720
01:23:56,459 --> 01:23:54,489
pathy part is about feelings

1721
01:23:58,290 --> 01:23:56,469
sopia sometimes people think of it as

1722
01:24:01,979 --> 01:23:58,300
mind reading or thought reading and it's

1723
01:24:04,770 --> 01:24:01,989
not that really it's more about gaining

1724
01:24:08,130 --> 01:24:04,780
an empathic sense a feeling sense of

1725
01:24:09,540 --> 01:24:08,140
somebody at a distance because you know

1726
01:24:11,850 --> 01:24:09,550
we hear it all the time

1727
01:24:14,850 --> 01:24:11,860
how'd you communicate with the et well I

1728
01:24:20,060 --> 01:24:14,860
use mental telepathy right right

1729
01:24:23,189 --> 01:24:20,070
okay telekinesis telekinesis is a

1730
01:24:24,720 --> 01:24:23,199
popular term for what we would call

1731
01:24:28,350 --> 01:24:24,730
within a discipline we call it

1732
01:24:31,229 --> 01:24:28,360
psychokinesis or pique it'sit's the same

1733
01:24:34,350 --> 01:24:31,239
thing it basically means that it's a

1734
01:24:36,570 --> 01:24:34,360
mind matter direct inter interaction the

1735
01:24:39,930 --> 01:24:36,580
mind causing something to happen at a

1736
01:24:42,810 --> 01:24:39,940
distance we're today I think the pop

1737
01:24:45,660 --> 01:24:42,820
culture way of looking at telekinesis is

1738
01:24:48,479 --> 01:24:45,670
you're knocking an object off a table or

1739
01:24:51,689 --> 01:24:48,489
starting a fire right so that we would

1740
01:24:53,220 --> 01:24:51,699
call macro piqué the macroscopic effect

1741
01:24:58,320 --> 01:24:53,230
meaning that you could see it with the

1742
01:25:00,020 --> 01:24:58,330
naked eye there are lots of anecdotes of

1743
01:25:02,970 --> 01:25:00,030
people who claim that they can do that

1744
01:25:06,360 --> 01:25:02,980
in real magic I have a chapter devoted

1745
01:25:10,649 --> 01:25:06,370
to these macro PK events but they are

1746
01:25:13,800 --> 01:25:10,659
extremely rare it is so rare that I have

1747
01:25:17,070 --> 01:25:13,810
yet to find anybody who can do these

1748
01:25:18,660 --> 01:25:17,080
effects on demand to do it spontaneously

1749
01:25:21,180 --> 01:25:18,670
there are all kinds of weird stuff that

1750
01:25:23,280 --> 01:25:21,190
happens spontaneously but to do it on

1751
01:25:24,410 --> 01:25:23,290
demand in the lab under controlled

1752
01:25:31,350 --> 01:25:24,420
conditions

1753
01:25:33,689 --> 01:25:31,360
extremely rare before we move on I have

1754
01:25:36,360 --> 01:25:33,699
you what you're saying spontaneously

1755
01:25:39,030 --> 01:25:36,370
you're in the lab have you seen somebody

1756
01:25:42,270 --> 01:25:39,040
knock books off the shelf or I could

1757
01:25:45,030 --> 01:25:42,280
chair over we once said somebody in the

1758
01:25:46,560 --> 01:25:45,040
lab doing an experiment and she got kind

1759
01:25:50,459 --> 01:25:46,570
of angry because she wasn't getting a

1760
01:25:53,580 --> 01:25:50,469
good result so she swore at the

1761
01:25:55,830 --> 01:25:53,590
equipment and at that very moment all of

1762
01:26:00,540 --> 01:25:55,840
the power was knocked out in the county

1763
01:26:02,070 --> 01:26:00,550
where I live so yeah so I mean my

1764
01:26:03,930 --> 01:26:02,080
experience of it was

1765
01:26:06,450 --> 01:26:03,940
all the lights went out in the lab and

1766
01:26:08,730 --> 01:26:06,460
then we started checking we said oh it

1767
01:26:10,050 --> 01:26:08,740
went out in the whole campus oops it

1768
01:26:11,760 --> 01:26:10,060
went out in the whole town

1769
01:26:13,950 --> 01:26:11,770
it went out actually in their entire

1770
01:26:15,840 --> 01:26:13,960
county wait a minute somebody told me

1771
01:26:20,400 --> 01:26:15,850
this story who were you in the lab with

1772
01:26:23,430 --> 01:26:20,410
we was at Russell no it's it's a lady I

1773
01:26:26,610 --> 01:26:23,440
know this in a nearby town who is one of

1774
01:26:29,220 --> 01:26:26,620
those natural psychic types yes but but

1775
01:26:32,760 --> 01:26:29,230
also has been initiated as both a

1776
01:26:35,070 --> 01:26:32,770
Siberian shaman and as a Mongolian

1777
01:26:38,400 --> 01:26:35,080
shaman for the the only woman that we

1778
01:26:40,110 --> 01:26:38,410
know of that is actually initiated in

1779
01:26:43,530 --> 01:26:40,120
both of those traditions but she's an

1780
01:26:47,570 --> 01:26:43,540
American lady incredible incredible now

1781
01:26:51,780 --> 01:26:47,580
okay so you're saying that you felt that

1782
01:26:54,390 --> 01:26:51,790
these two incidents were connected well

1783
01:26:56,760 --> 01:26:54,400
it that's what I mean by spontaneous so

1784
01:27:01,530 --> 01:26:56,770
this was a correlation and time where

1785
01:27:03,540 --> 01:27:01,540
she basically exclaimed that she was

1786
01:27:06,120 --> 01:27:03,550
really angry and wanted to change the

1787
01:27:08,520 --> 01:27:06,130
system and so at that moment at the

1788
01:27:10,050 --> 01:27:08,530
moment that she said that all of the

1789
01:27:12,960 --> 01:27:10,060
lights went out all the power went out

1790
01:27:16,740 --> 01:27:12,970
for a space of about I don't know 40

1791
01:27:18,630 --> 01:27:16,750
square miles so so did she do that or

1792
01:27:21,050 --> 01:27:18,640
not well that's the problem you see it

1793
01:27:23,940 --> 01:27:21,060
wasn't part of the control right and

1794
01:27:27,180 --> 01:27:23,950
even for myself once had a so-called

1795
01:27:30,060 --> 01:27:27,190
spoon bending party I bent the bowl of a

1796
01:27:31,410 --> 01:27:30,070
big soup spoon in half and I know it

1797
01:27:32,910 --> 01:27:31,420
didn't use force because I remember

1798
01:27:34,800 --> 01:27:32,920
looking at my fingers thinking how in

1799
01:27:37,320 --> 01:27:34,810
the world did I do that and I didn't

1800
01:27:39,210 --> 01:27:37,330
there's no indentation on my fingers but

1801
01:27:41,970 --> 01:27:39,220
somehow I bent the bowl of a spoon in

1802
01:27:46,020 --> 01:27:41,980
half well you can't do that but I did it

1803
01:27:48,060 --> 01:27:46,030
so and you couldn't repeat it no I I

1804
01:27:49,620 --> 01:27:48,070
don't know what I did so I don't know

1805
01:27:51,420 --> 01:27:49,630
how to repeat it you should have asked

1806
01:27:55,350 --> 01:27:51,430
okay that was good that was forty square

1807
01:27:57,930 --> 01:27:55,360
miles let's do San Jose next yeah so

1808
01:28:00,330 --> 01:27:57,940
this is it's important in discussing

1809
01:28:03,870 --> 01:28:00,340
these macro effects because they're so

1810
01:28:06,240 --> 01:28:03,880
big and yet not under your control that

1811
01:28:09,060 --> 01:28:06,250
you actually become scared I was scared

1812
01:28:11,280 --> 01:28:09,070
after I figured out I've just been ttle

1813
01:28:13,470 --> 01:28:11,290
in a way that's impossible and I was on

1814
01:28:15,100 --> 01:28:13,480
the airplane going home still trying to

1815
01:28:17,080 --> 01:28:15,110
do it with a different spoon

1816
01:28:19,480 --> 01:28:17,090
and I really got scared when I realized

1817
01:28:22,330 --> 01:28:19,490
that I don't know how I did it and I

1818
01:28:24,400 --> 01:28:22,340
don't know the extent so maybe I'll

1819
01:28:27,100 --> 01:28:24,410
succeed by having the the wings of the

1820
01:28:29,200 --> 01:28:27,110
airplane drop off we've got one minute

1821
01:28:31,650 --> 01:28:29,210
left let's do remote viewing and

1822
01:28:34,150 --> 01:28:31,660
precognition give me the two definitions

1823
01:28:36,220 --> 01:28:34,160
remote viewing is a modern term for

1824
01:28:38,280 --> 01:28:36,230
clairvoyance meaning perception through

1825
01:28:40,960 --> 01:28:38,290
space or time that's all it is

1826
01:28:49,030 --> 01:28:40,970
precognition is perception through time

1827
01:28:52,240 --> 01:28:49,040
and is that okay is one different from

1828
01:28:55,060 --> 01:28:52,250
the other or is it like square and a

1829
01:28:59,320 --> 01:28:55,070
rectangle situation yeah there are you

1830
01:29:00,730 --> 01:28:59,330
familiar nonnamous and euphemisms that

1831
01:29:03,820 --> 01:29:00,740
the only difference with remote viewing

1832
01:29:06,940 --> 01:29:03,830
is that it implies a particular training

1833
01:29:09,250 --> 01:29:06,950
method to get there but the underlying

1834
01:29:11,400 --> 01:29:09,260
phenomenon is clairvoyance mister

1835
01:29:13,750 --> 01:29:11,410
clairvoyance includes precognition

1836
01:29:15,520 --> 01:29:13,760
exactly let's take a break right here do

1837
01:29:19,450 --> 01:29:15,530
you consider yourself a good remote

1838
01:29:24,010 --> 01:29:19,460
viewer not as talented as many that I've

1839
01:29:24,370 --> 01:29:24,020
met yeah I so want to learn this is fade

1840
01:29:25,750 --> 01:29:24,380
to black

1841
01:29:27,700 --> 01:29:25,760
I'm your host Amy Church our guest

1842
01:29:30,010 --> 01:29:27,710
tonight Dean Radin we're gonna pick up

1843
01:29:35,900 --> 01:29:30,020
where we left off stay with us we'll be

1844
01:29:35,910 --> 01:29:45,740
[Music]

1845
01:29:51,950 --> 01:29:48,919
way out here we listen to Jimmy Church

1846
01:29:54,450 --> 01:29:51,960
you're listening to faint and black

1847
01:29:57,300 --> 01:29:54,460
always on the edge of the hottest

1848
01:29:57,810 --> 01:29:57,310
alternative talk jimmy church with fade

1849
01:30:18,479 --> 01:29:57,820
to black

1850
01:30:21,870 --> 01:30:18,489
stay GRA radio.com Akane's earthquakes

1851
01:30:24,360 --> 01:30:21,880
wildfires this year we've experienced

1852
01:30:26,640 --> 01:30:24,370
more than our fair share this is Jimmy

1853
01:30:28,979 --> 01:30:26,650
Church a fade to black and last month I

1854
01:30:31,169 --> 01:30:28,989
decided to make sure my family does not

1855
01:30:33,890 --> 01:30:31,179
have to worry about food should we get

1856
01:30:36,780 --> 01:30:33,900
caught in a real emergency situation

1857
01:30:38,610 --> 01:30:36,790
introducing Humana a healthy storable

1858
01:30:40,770 --> 01:30:38,620
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1859
01:30:43,080 --> 01:30:40,780
want to eat it every day instead of just

1860
01:30:45,120 --> 01:30:43,090
during those times of duress all new

1861
01:30:48,630 --> 01:30:45,130
manna products have a 25 year shelf life

1862
01:30:51,240 --> 01:30:48,640
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1863
01:30:53,130 --> 01:30:51,250
and are made in America with the new

1864
01:30:54,990 --> 01:30:53,140
manna pack in your home you'll be able

1865
01:30:57,540 --> 01:30:55,000
to sleep at night knowing that you've

1866
01:31:00,720 --> 01:30:57,550
protected your family not only have I

1867
01:31:02,820 --> 01:31:00,730
tasted and tested I own it now you can

1868
01:31:05,040 --> 01:31:02,830
too just click on the new manna banner

1869
01:31:06,900 --> 01:31:05,050
on Jimmy Church radio.com and use the

1870
01:31:09,330 --> 01:31:06,910
promo code Jimmy when you order in

1871
01:31:11,330 --> 01:31:09,340
addition to a discount we'll send you an

1872
01:31:15,570 --> 01:31:11,340
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1873
01:31:18,419 --> 01:31:15,580
seriously gobekli tepe do you want to be

1874
01:31:20,400 --> 01:31:18,429
an official fade or not of course you do

1875
01:31:22,979 --> 01:31:20,410
this is Jimmy Church of fade to black

1876
01:31:27,660 --> 01:31:22,989
just go to our membership section at

1877
01:31:30,140 --> 01:31:27,670
Jimmy Church radio.com so you love talk

1878
01:31:33,350 --> 01:31:30,150
radio then you'll love talk stream

1879
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1880
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1881
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1882
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1884
01:31:47,250 --> 01:31:44,800
smartphone or tablet finding your

1885
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favorite talk shows all in one place has

1886
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gotten a whole lot easier just go to

1887
01:31:52,930 --> 01:31:50,960
talk stream live

1888
01:31:56,640 --> 01:31:52,940
calm be sure to download the free apps

1889
01:32:00,010 --> 01:31:56,650
from Google Play or the iTunes App Store

1890
01:32:08,350 --> 01:32:00,020
you listen to us and we listen to you

1891
01:32:10,570 --> 01:32:08,360
and so does the CIA jgr a radio.com if

1892
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1893
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1894
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1895
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hundreds of dollars in energy and where

1896
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1897
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1898
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1899
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1900
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1901
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1902
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1903
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1904
01:32:39,070 --> 01:32:35,330
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1905
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that's best water 1 2 3 com are you

1906
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intrigued by paranormal talk radio you

1907
01:32:47,170 --> 01:32:44,300
love the new paranormal radio app from

1908
01:32:49,479 --> 01:32:47,180
torque stream live you'll find a great

1909
01:32:52,600 --> 01:32:49,489
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1910
01:32:55,030 --> 01:32:52,610
ghosts strange phenomena and much more

1911
01:32:57,250 --> 01:32:55,040
download the paranormal radio app now

1912
01:32:59,590 --> 01:32:57,260
and start listening to the very best in

1913
01:33:01,090 --> 01:32:59,600
paranormal talk entertainment including

1914
01:33:04,090 --> 01:33:01,100
the network you're listening to right

1915
01:33:08,729 --> 01:33:04,100
now the paranormal radio app free in

1916
01:33:11,080 --> 01:33:08,739
Google Play and the iOS App Store you

1917
01:33:13,360 --> 01:33:11,090
are listening to fade to black

1918
01:33:18,160 --> 01:33:13,370
with Jimmy Church on the game changer

1919
01:33:20,229 --> 01:33:18,170
Network hi I'm Lisa Vance you're

1920
01:33:23,200 --> 01:33:20,239
listening to Jimmy Church this is a

1921
01:33:27,030 --> 01:33:23,210
revolution the revolution will not be

1922
01:33:31,960 --> 01:33:27,040
televised the revolution is on radio

1923
01:34:10,370 --> 01:34:07,030
[Music]

1924
01:34:15,479 --> 01:34:12,780
welcome back fade to black I'm assuming

1925
01:34:19,470 --> 01:34:15,489
Church you can follow me on twitter @jj

1926
01:34:21,899 --> 01:34:19,480
do hashtag f2 B is the sandbox hashtag

1927
01:34:24,060 --> 01:34:21,909
if to be Q is fade to black questions

1928
01:34:25,709 --> 01:34:24,070
I've got a few lined up here for Dean

1929
01:34:28,500 --> 01:34:25,719
actually two as well and thank you

1930
01:34:31,050 --> 01:34:28,510
everybody for going nuts on on Twitter

1931
01:34:32,149 --> 01:34:31,060
219 what's your what's your a Twitter

1932
01:34:35,339 --> 01:34:32,159
handle

1933
01:34:36,930 --> 01:34:35,349
that's a good question

1934
01:34:39,780 --> 01:34:36,940
you were supposed to know I was gonna

1935
01:34:42,629 --> 01:34:39,790
ask that question yeah but I can't know

1936
01:34:44,370 --> 01:34:42,639
everything all at once I suppose it's

1937
01:34:46,530 --> 01:34:44,380
probably Dean Radin okay there you go

1938
01:34:50,129 --> 01:34:46,540
and I think we have it up there in

1939
01:34:52,500 --> 01:34:50,139
Twitter and you can follow Dean and Dean

1940
01:34:54,600 --> 01:34:52,510
Radin now we're gonna pick up where we

1941
01:34:56,790 --> 01:34:54,610
left off we were working on definitions

1942
01:35:01,820 --> 01:34:56,800
and now we're gonna discuss real magic

1943
01:35:07,500 --> 01:35:01,830
what's the definition of real magic so

1944
01:35:10,770 --> 01:35:07,510
real magic is a way of talking about

1945
01:35:12,750 --> 01:35:10,780
magic which is not Harry Potter and not

1946
01:35:14,729 --> 01:35:12,760
Harry Houdini because those are the

1947
01:35:18,089 --> 01:35:14,739
other two types of magic those are both

1948
01:35:19,890 --> 01:35:18,099
fictional magic or fake magic so I

1949
01:35:23,100 --> 01:35:19,900
wanted to talk about the real magic the

1950
01:35:26,339 --> 01:35:23,110
real stuff and we earlier were talking

1951
01:35:28,589 --> 01:35:26,349
about everything from shamanism to

1952
01:35:30,990 --> 01:35:28,599
Christian Science and new thought it's

1953
01:35:36,020 --> 01:35:31,000
somewhere between 10 and 50 thousand

1954
01:35:38,580 --> 01:35:36,030
year history of the esoteric ideas well

1955
01:35:41,209 --> 01:35:38,590
there are many many scholars who've

1956
01:35:43,919 --> 01:35:41,219
written hundreds of thousands of books

1957
01:35:47,720 --> 01:35:43,929
about in fact there are even academic

1958
01:35:50,339 --> 01:35:47,730
societies that study these traditions

1959
01:35:53,910 --> 01:35:50,349
but I was interested in not so much in

1960
01:35:55,770 --> 01:35:53,920
the nuances between the say neoplatonism

1961
01:35:57,410 --> 01:35:55,780
and Gnosticism men even terror

1962
01:36:00,419 --> 01:35:57,420
specialists and those kinds of

1963
01:36:02,850 --> 01:36:00,429
comparisons I was interested in what's

1964
01:36:05,220 --> 01:36:02,860
the common thread throughout the all of

1965
01:36:06,390 --> 01:36:05,230
the esoteric traditions and this is

1966
01:36:08,430 --> 01:36:06,400
sometimes called the perennial

1967
01:36:11,250 --> 01:36:08,440
philosophy which is the name of a book

1968
01:36:12,930 --> 01:36:11,260
written by Aldous Huxley and the

1969
01:36:17,250 --> 01:36:12,940
perennial philosophy is it makes it very

1970
01:36:19,280 --> 01:36:17,260
clear what what this esoteric cosmology

1971
01:36:22,219 --> 01:36:19,290
is all about it's basically three words

1972
01:36:24,229 --> 01:36:22,229
consciousness is fundamental

1973
01:36:26,689 --> 01:36:24,239
that's what the esoteric traditions are

1974
01:36:29,859 --> 01:36:26,699
all about so consciousness is

1975
01:36:32,209 --> 01:36:29,869
fundamental is completely opposite from

1976
01:36:34,699 --> 01:36:32,219
what is the prevailing scientific

1977
01:36:36,979 --> 01:36:34,709
worldview and this is one of the reasons

1978
01:36:38,719 --> 01:36:36,989
why from a mainstream scientific

1979
01:36:41,359 --> 01:36:38,729
perspective which is how most people are

1980
01:36:43,040 --> 01:36:41,369
trained today that things like psychic

1981
01:36:46,759 --> 01:36:43,050
phenomena and remote viewing the whole

1982
01:36:48,560 --> 01:36:46,769
whole domain of these experiences are

1983
01:36:50,810 --> 01:36:48,570
considered somewhere between ridiculous

1984
01:36:53,449 --> 01:36:50,820
and impossible because it doesn't fit

1985
01:36:56,149 --> 01:36:53,459
the worldview that were taught but it

1986
01:36:58,100 --> 01:36:56,159
does fit the esoteric worldview because

1987
01:37:01,370 --> 01:36:58,110
if consciousness is fundamental it means

1988
01:37:05,629 --> 01:37:01,380
that this internal sense of awareness

1989
01:37:07,339 --> 01:37:05,639
that we have our experiences that seems

1990
01:37:08,750 --> 01:37:07,349
to be most of the time related to our

1991
01:37:10,879 --> 01:37:08,760
brain or at least inside our head

1992
01:37:15,290 --> 01:37:10,889
somewhere from a scientific perspective

1993
01:37:16,939 --> 01:37:15,300
we have no idea how that happens yet and

1994
01:37:20,109 --> 01:37:16,949
this is one of the points in the book

1995
01:37:23,930 --> 01:37:20,119
that science this is one of the major

1996
01:37:25,640 --> 01:37:23,940
outstanding issues in science is how to

1997
01:37:28,899 --> 01:37:25,650
account for the fact that we are aware

1998
01:37:33,020 --> 01:37:28,909
in fact it's it's such a strange

1999
01:37:35,649 --> 01:37:33,030
question to even ask people why you know

2000
01:37:38,239 --> 01:37:35,659
what do you think your awareness is I

2001
01:37:40,270 --> 01:37:38,249
remember way back when when I was going

2002
01:37:42,229 --> 01:37:40,280
to Princeton I mentioned to an uncle

2003
01:37:43,459 --> 01:37:42,239
that was going to Prince and he said

2004
01:37:46,489 --> 01:37:43,469
well what are you gonna do I said I'm a

2005
01:37:48,169 --> 01:37:46,499
studying consciousness it took him a

2006
01:37:50,660 --> 01:37:48,179
long time to figure out that that's the

2007
01:37:53,799 --> 01:37:50,670
thing that you can study right you're

2008
01:37:57,169 --> 01:37:53,809
studying the nature of awareness itself

2009
01:37:58,729 --> 01:37:57,179
up until fairly recently with the

2010
01:38:00,890 --> 01:37:58,739
neuroscience is the only way we could do

2011
01:38:03,379 --> 01:38:00,900
that was by introspection it's like

2012
01:38:05,750 --> 01:38:03,389
meditation you can introspect and you

2013
01:38:07,879 --> 01:38:05,760
begin to learn about the nature of

2014
01:38:09,589 --> 01:38:07,889
consciousness that way but from a

2015
01:38:12,859 --> 01:38:09,599
scientific perspective the only way that

2016
01:38:15,290 --> 01:38:12,869
we've had to do study consciousness is

2017
01:38:17,299 --> 01:38:15,300
by studying the brain and that that's

2018
01:38:19,759 --> 01:38:17,309
the way that most neuroscientists today

2019
01:38:23,750 --> 01:38:19,769
think about it they think that awareness

2020
01:38:25,430 --> 01:38:23,760
is the brain but all of the psychic

2021
01:38:28,600 --> 01:38:25,440
phenomena suggest that that is not the

2022
01:38:31,250 --> 01:38:28,610
case that's one again another reason why

2023
01:38:32,509 --> 01:38:31,260
psychic phenomena is considered to be so

2024
01:38:35,390 --> 01:38:32,519
controversial from a scientific

2025
01:38:37,850 --> 01:38:35,400
perspective because they don't fit

2026
01:38:40,070 --> 01:38:37,860
so the esoteric idea is which is

2027
01:38:42,080 --> 01:38:40,080
basically a set of philosophies we're

2028
01:38:45,230 --> 01:38:42,090
living within a set of assumptions all

2029
01:38:48,950 --> 01:38:45,240
the time real magic is actually a book

2030
01:38:51,470 --> 01:38:48,960
about philosophy but my editor said you

2031
01:38:52,880 --> 01:38:51,480
cannot put the word philosophy in a book

2032
01:38:57,680 --> 01:38:52,890
that you expect more than three people

2033
01:39:00,800 --> 01:38:57,690
to read so okay well it's about the

2034
01:39:02,930 --> 01:39:00,810
philosophy of magic which is really

2035
01:39:04,910 --> 01:39:02,940
about our assumptions well how do what

2036
01:39:08,420 --> 01:39:04,920
do we think the world is actually made

2037
01:39:10,600 --> 01:39:08,430
of so you have ten or twenty thousand

2038
01:39:13,040 --> 01:39:10,610
years of people who pretty much agreed

2039
01:39:13,820 --> 01:39:13,050
that the world is made up out of

2040
01:39:15,350 --> 01:39:13,830
consciousness

2041
01:39:18,950 --> 01:39:15,360
it's literally made out of awareness

2042
01:39:23,480 --> 01:39:18,960
itself so real magic then fits in with

2043
01:39:25,520 --> 01:39:23,490
this idea because if awareness is it the

2044
01:39:28,430 --> 01:39:25,530
real bottom it's like the bottom of

2045
01:39:31,960 --> 01:39:28,440
everything not matter and energy but

2046
01:39:35,390 --> 01:39:31,970
consciousness itself then suddenly

2047
01:39:39,230 --> 01:39:35,400
awareness is primary over the physical

2048
01:39:41,090 --> 01:39:39,240
world and awareness being primary means

2049
01:39:42,560 --> 01:39:41,100
that it's not in the physical world the

2050
01:39:45,380 --> 01:39:42,570
physical world is emerging out of

2051
01:39:46,910 --> 01:39:45,390
awareness itself that's what all the

2052
01:39:50,000 --> 01:39:46,920
esoteric religions say it's what all the

2053
01:39:51,860 --> 01:39:50,010
Mystics say ancient mystics and modern

2054
01:39:53,900 --> 01:39:51,870
mystics they all say the same thing what

2055
01:39:56,570 --> 01:39:53,910
about let me jump in real cool what

2056
01:39:56,990 --> 01:39:56,580
about Hermeticism and an alchemy too as

2057
01:39:59,120 --> 01:39:57,000
well

2058
01:40:03,470 --> 01:39:59,130
it's all part of the same tradition it

2059
01:40:05,060 --> 01:40:03,480
is yes so you you do the synthesis and

2060
01:40:07,460 --> 01:40:05,070
saying whoa okay it's all about

2061
01:40:11,120 --> 01:40:07,470
consciousness but you look then at the

2062
01:40:13,910 --> 01:40:11,130
practices of these esoteric traditions

2063
01:40:17,060 --> 01:40:13,920
it falls into three classes and so these

2064
01:40:20,080 --> 01:40:17,070
are things that people do based on this

2065
01:40:23,540 --> 01:40:20,090
cosmology so the analogy I make is that

2066
01:40:27,860 --> 01:40:23,550
technology today's technology is to

2067
01:40:30,740 --> 01:40:27,870
science as magical practices are to the

2068
01:40:32,360 --> 01:40:30,750
esoteric traditions so the magical

2069
01:40:35,150 --> 01:40:32,370
practices is a technology of

2070
01:40:38,360 --> 01:40:35,160
consciousness so the three classes are

2071
01:40:39,430 --> 01:40:38,370
divination divination means perception

2072
01:40:41,780 --> 01:40:39,440
through time and space

2073
01:40:45,020 --> 01:40:41,790
whether it's associated with crystal

2074
01:40:48,770 --> 01:40:45,030
balls with doing tarot cards with the II

2075
01:40:51,020 --> 01:40:48,780
Ching so on the next practice is mad

2076
01:40:54,500 --> 01:40:51,030
a station or sometimes called power of

2077
01:40:57,500 --> 01:40:54,510
will which is psychokinesis it's mine

2078
01:41:00,109 --> 01:40:57,510
matter interaction the third category is

2079
01:41:02,569 --> 01:41:00,119
called Theor G which is all about

2080
01:41:06,109 --> 01:41:02,579
communicating with disembodied spirits

2081
01:41:07,609 --> 01:41:06,119
or entities of some type so that's

2082
01:41:11,089 --> 01:41:07,619
basically it those are the three types

2083
01:41:13,819 --> 01:41:11,099
of practices that we call magic real

2084
01:41:15,979 --> 01:41:13,829
magic and they're all based on the this

2085
01:41:17,899 --> 01:41:15,989
esoteric idea that everything is

2086
01:41:21,319 --> 01:41:17,909
fundamentally made out of consciousness

2087
01:41:23,479 --> 01:41:21,329
and how do you which is what is

2088
01:41:26,740 --> 01:41:23,489
discussed in the book of course but how

2089
01:41:31,310 --> 01:41:26,750
do you tackle presenting scientific

2090
01:41:33,890 --> 01:41:31,320
evidence for all of all three and and

2091
01:41:41,240 --> 01:41:33,900
one other question and and let's tackle

2092
01:41:43,970 --> 01:41:41,250
- are you able to see movement at the

2093
01:41:48,350 --> 01:41:43,980
atomic or subatomic level with

2094
01:41:50,359 --> 01:41:48,360
microscopes of the effects because you

2095
01:41:53,240 --> 01:41:50,369
mentioned bacteria earlier - as well I

2096
01:41:56,450 --> 01:41:53,250
find that fascinating where you are able

2097
01:41:59,540 --> 01:41:56,460
to show movement like maybe reversing

2098
01:42:02,779 --> 01:41:59,550
the orbit of an electron or some crazy

2099
01:42:04,879 --> 01:42:02,789
thing are you able to present that

2100
01:42:08,149 --> 01:42:04,889
scientifically - as well that would be

2101
01:42:10,580 --> 01:42:08,159
almost the Holy Grail yeah so the

2102
01:42:13,580 --> 01:42:10,590
smallest system that's been

2103
01:42:16,580 --> 01:42:13,590
systematically looked at is photons so

2104
01:42:18,250 --> 01:42:16,590
photons are pretty small it's it's of

2105
01:42:21,890 --> 01:42:18,260
course a packet of electromagnetic

2106
01:42:23,959 --> 01:42:21,900
energy and yeah there are experiments

2107
01:42:27,950 --> 01:42:23,969
that show that photon behavior can be

2108
01:42:30,319 --> 01:42:27,960
changed so that would fall into the

2109
01:42:32,350 --> 01:42:30,329
force of will or manifestation because

2110
01:42:34,700 --> 01:42:32,360
it has to do with the power of intention

2111
01:42:36,799 --> 01:42:34,710
so how do you demonstrate that something

2112
01:42:40,220 --> 01:42:36,809
like divination this magical practice

2113
01:42:41,930 --> 01:42:40,230
exists well as you you just heard

2114
01:42:44,299 --> 01:42:41,940
divination is all about perception

2115
01:42:45,859 --> 01:42:44,309
through space and time well that sounds

2116
01:42:47,779 --> 01:42:45,869
a lot like clairvoyance because that's

2117
01:42:51,220 --> 01:42:47,789
exactly what clairvoyance is right

2118
01:42:53,479 --> 01:42:51,230
precognition is perception through time

2119
01:42:57,020 --> 01:42:53,489
clairvoyance is sometimes thought of as

2120
01:42:59,750 --> 01:42:57,030
perception through space so that so this

2121
01:43:02,149 --> 01:42:59,760
is where my my inspiration came from

2122
01:43:02,570 --> 01:43:02,159
when I've been studying clairvoyance and

2123
01:43:05,090 --> 01:43:02,580
these other

2124
01:43:08,390 --> 01:43:05,100
psychic abilities and after looking at

2125
01:43:10,700 --> 01:43:08,400
this history of the esoteric ideas I

2126
01:43:12,020 --> 01:43:10,710
realized that what parapsychologists

2127
01:43:15,080 --> 01:43:12,030
have been doing for about a hundred and

2128
01:43:17,900 --> 01:43:15,090
fifty years is very explicitly studying

2129
01:43:20,420 --> 01:43:17,910
magical practices so we study

2130
01:43:22,520 --> 01:43:20,430
precognition well--that's divination we

2131
01:43:24,740 --> 01:43:22,530
study psychokinesis that's what a

2132
01:43:26,450 --> 01:43:24,750
magician would call manifestation we

2133
01:43:29,060 --> 01:43:26,460
study mediumship or near-death

2134
01:43:32,150 --> 01:43:29,070
experience that's what a magician will

2135
01:43:34,880 --> 01:43:32,160
call Theo G so we're using modern

2136
01:43:37,820 --> 01:43:34,890
controlled scientific methods to study

2137
01:43:39,910 --> 01:43:37,830
these ancient magical practices and when

2138
01:43:42,290 --> 01:43:39,920
you do that you find that sure enough

2139
01:43:44,450 --> 01:43:42,300
some of these magical practices are

2140
01:43:47,780 --> 01:43:44,460
actually real as best as we can tell

2141
01:43:50,240 --> 01:43:47,790
using scientific methods and so let's go

2142
01:43:52,960 --> 01:43:50,250
to psychokinesis

2143
01:43:58,310 --> 01:43:52,970
for instance what type of experiment

2144
01:44:00,320 --> 01:43:58,320
have you set up to to present this so

2145
01:44:04,130 --> 01:44:00,330
I'll just give one example what you talk

2146
01:44:06,920 --> 01:44:04,140
about in the book and this is with a

2147
01:44:10,190 --> 01:44:06,930
colleague in Taiwan where we wanted to

2148
01:44:13,550 --> 01:44:10,200
see whether intentionally affected water

2149
01:44:15,530 --> 01:44:13,560
would make plants grow differently so

2150
01:44:17,120 --> 01:44:15,540
there was a Buddhist there's a Buddhist

2151
01:44:20,390 --> 01:44:17,130
temple in Taiwan we asked the three

2152
01:44:23,870 --> 01:44:20,400
senior monks there to intentionally

2153
01:44:26,570 --> 01:44:23,880
affect water so that the water would be

2154
01:44:29,120 --> 01:44:26,580
used to hydrate seeds and then the seed

2155
01:44:31,840 --> 01:44:29,130
to grow plants and then there was

2156
01:44:36,440 --> 01:44:31,850
identical batch of water that was not

2157
01:44:39,380 --> 01:44:36,450
intentionally affected so in order to do

2158
01:44:41,320 --> 01:44:39,390
this in a proper way after the the water

2159
01:44:43,460 --> 01:44:41,330
is affected and we have control water

2160
01:44:45,500 --> 01:44:43,470
from that point on everything is

2161
01:44:47,360 --> 01:44:45,510
double-blind so the person who is

2162
01:44:49,580 --> 01:44:47,370
treating the seeds and measuring the

2163
01:44:51,560 --> 01:44:49,590
plants and so on they have no idea which

2164
01:44:53,750 --> 01:44:51,570
which batch of water they're dealing

2165
01:44:56,360 --> 01:44:53,760
with but they use both batches in

2166
01:44:58,610 --> 01:44:56,370
growing these plants and then later the

2167
01:45:00,410 --> 01:44:58,620
analyst gets the data and they don't

2168
01:45:02,090 --> 01:45:00,420
know which is which either and they

2169
01:45:05,420 --> 01:45:02,100
analyze it and get some kind of result

2170
01:45:08,600 --> 01:45:05,430
well before we get to the results how

2171
01:45:10,460 --> 01:45:08,610
are they affecting it you know what are

2172
01:45:15,200 --> 01:45:10,470
they doing are they sitting and looking

2173
01:45:18,020 --> 01:45:15,210
at a jar of water

2174
01:45:19,940 --> 01:45:18,030
you know how is that happening there are

2175
01:45:24,010 --> 01:45:19,950
bottles of water in front of them

2176
01:45:26,240 --> 01:45:24,020
they're given instructions to bless

2177
01:45:27,920 --> 01:45:26,250
intentionally bless the water so that

2178
01:45:31,190 --> 01:45:27,930
plants that are grown with the water

2179
01:45:33,470 --> 01:45:31,200
would would grow better would be have

2180
01:45:36,200 --> 01:45:33,480
show more vigor and better growth right

2181
01:45:37,880 --> 01:45:36,210
and in order to prevent the other

2182
01:45:40,100 --> 01:45:37,890
bottles of water which are in the same

2183
01:45:42,680 --> 01:45:40,110
building from accidentally being

2184
01:45:44,360 --> 01:45:42,690
infected by the blessing exactly they

2185
01:45:46,400 --> 01:45:44,370
were asked to do a secondary blessing

2186
01:45:48,590 --> 01:45:46,410
which was to make sure that the control

2187
01:45:50,360 --> 01:45:48,600
water did not get the blessing like an

2188
01:45:52,820 --> 01:45:50,370
anti blessing on the control water so

2189
01:45:54,650 --> 01:45:52,830
they'd keep it like normal water an anti

2190
01:45:56,690 --> 01:45:54,660
blessing right right yeah because we

2191
01:45:58,970 --> 01:45:56,700
don't know we don't know the extent to

2192
01:46:02,450 --> 01:45:58,980
which these things work well the anti

2193
01:46:05,270 --> 01:46:02,460
blessing is just as strong as the

2194
01:46:08,120 --> 01:46:05,280
blessing well we didn't say that to make

2195
01:46:11,270 --> 01:46:08,130
it like a literally anti blessing it was

2196
01:46:13,310 --> 01:46:11,280
more like the shield that water against

2197
01:46:15,620 --> 01:46:13,320
the blessing sure it was so it wouldn't

2198
01:46:18,290 --> 01:46:15,630
be affected this is exciting ok so what

2199
01:46:20,060 --> 01:46:18,300
happened so the plants are grown by

2200
01:46:21,640 --> 01:46:20,070
somebody who basically that's their job

2201
01:46:25,130 --> 01:46:21,650
they just grow these plants all the time

2202
01:46:26,840 --> 01:46:25,140
and this was by a plant biologist who so

2203
01:46:30,170 --> 01:46:26,850
the technicians that's all they do is

2204
01:46:33,130 --> 01:46:30,180
draw grow these kinds of seeds and so we

2205
01:46:35,210 --> 01:46:33,140
we ended up doing four experiments

2206
01:46:37,960 --> 01:46:35,220
slightly different conditions with each

2207
01:46:41,180 --> 01:46:37,970
one and also different kinds of seeds

2208
01:46:44,920 --> 01:46:41,190
the seed that we're using is called a

2209
01:46:48,740 --> 01:46:44,930
rabbit us a rabid oopss thaliana and

2210
01:46:51,590 --> 01:46:48,750
it's we chose it because this is a plant

2211
01:46:54,710 --> 01:46:51,600
that's used in a lot of biological

2212
01:46:57,920 --> 01:46:54,720
experiments because its genome has been

2213
01:47:01,640 --> 01:46:57,930
full is known the complete genome and it

2214
01:47:03,890 --> 01:47:01,650
has like a lot of living systems we're

2215
01:47:07,100 --> 01:47:03,900
not that different from a banana for

2216
01:47:09,770 --> 01:47:07,110
example from from our genetics and this

2217
01:47:12,890 --> 01:47:09,780
rapid abscess thaliana seed also has

2218
01:47:15,050 --> 01:47:12,900
lots and lots of jeanna of genes in its

2219
01:47:18,610 --> 01:47:15,060
genome which are analogues to human

2220
01:47:20,960 --> 01:47:18,620
genes so you can study disease in

2221
01:47:23,990 --> 01:47:20,970
genetics by looking at different kinds

2222
01:47:25,760 --> 01:47:24,000
of plants what netic affects in the

2223
01:47:27,230 --> 01:47:25,770
plants and you know that it would be

2224
01:47:28,910 --> 01:47:27,240
similar in humans so that's why the

2225
01:47:32,209 --> 01:47:28,920
plant is used a lot yeah

2226
01:47:35,750 --> 01:47:32,219
medical research so we used a mutation

2227
01:47:38,479 --> 01:47:35,760
of the of this kind of plant we use the

2228
01:47:40,160 --> 01:47:38,489
what's called the wild-type which is the

2229
01:47:44,090 --> 01:47:40,170
plant that you'd find out out in the

2230
01:47:47,330 --> 01:47:44,100
world but a mutation which has more

2231
01:47:50,620 --> 01:47:47,340
cryptochrome it's a protein in the plant

2232
01:47:53,510 --> 01:47:50,630
than the wild-type so why cryptochrome

2233
01:47:56,270 --> 01:47:53,520
cryptochrome is called a flavo protein

2234
01:47:58,850 --> 01:47:56,280
it's the protein inside a plant that is

2235
01:48:00,919 --> 01:47:58,860
sensitive to blue light and in many

2236
01:48:04,610 --> 01:48:00,929
plants it's the it's the protein that

2237
01:48:07,040 --> 01:48:04,620
that that absorbs energy and causes the

2238
01:48:09,680 --> 01:48:07,050
plant to point itself towards the Sun

2239
01:48:11,479 --> 01:48:09,690
over the day so this the plant will kind

2240
01:48:14,330 --> 01:48:11,489
of move as the Sun moves because it's

2241
01:48:16,729 --> 01:48:14,340
pulling in energy well it turns out that

2242
01:48:18,950 --> 01:48:16,739
all living systems including humans have

2243
01:48:20,600 --> 01:48:18,960
cryptochrome and cryptochrome is very

2244
01:48:24,350 --> 01:48:20,610
interesting because it is thought to

2245
01:48:27,110 --> 01:48:24,360
have quantum properties in fact in birds

2246
01:48:29,840 --> 01:48:27,120
it is found in the retina of the birds

2247
01:48:33,470 --> 01:48:29,850
and many birds especially ones that

2248
01:48:36,470 --> 01:48:33,480
navigate long distances seem to do so by

2249
01:48:39,260 --> 01:48:36,480
actually seeing the Earth's lines of

2250
01:48:41,120 --> 01:48:39,270
magnetic force they can see it because

2251
01:48:43,240 --> 01:48:41,130
the cryptochrome is sensitive all the

2252
01:48:46,850 --> 01:48:43,250
way down to the Earth's magnetic field

2253
01:48:48,740 --> 01:48:46,860
so and because of a quantum property so

2254
01:48:53,120 --> 01:48:48,750
what we're doing that is using the plant

2255
01:48:55,820 --> 01:48:53,130
as a proxy for a quantum system a living

2256
01:48:57,530 --> 01:48:55,830
quantum system and there are no number

2257
01:48:59,330 --> 01:48:57,540
of things like photosynthesis and a few

2258
01:49:01,120 --> 01:48:59,340
other aspects of living systems which

2259
01:49:05,150 --> 01:49:01,130
are thought to operate in quantum ways

2260
01:49:06,950 --> 01:49:05,160
so we're able to use a macroscopic

2261
01:49:09,709 --> 01:49:06,960
object namely a plant that's around

2262
01:49:12,200 --> 01:49:09,719
three inches tall but is saturated with

2263
01:49:14,840 --> 01:49:12,210
this particular kind of protein which is

2264
01:49:15,680 --> 01:49:14,850
operating the quantum scale and we think

2265
01:49:18,680 --> 01:49:15,690
that there might be a relationship

2266
01:49:20,450 --> 01:49:18,690
between consciousness and quantum

2267
01:49:22,419 --> 01:49:20,460
phenomena and so this was a convenient

2268
01:49:26,150 --> 01:49:22,429
way to do it sure

2269
01:49:27,650 --> 01:49:26,160
so we we have the the treated the

2270
01:49:29,450 --> 01:49:27,660
Blessed water and the unblessed water

2271
01:49:31,280 --> 01:49:29,460
they used to hydrate the seeds the seeds

2272
01:49:33,140 --> 01:49:31,290
grow and one of the measures were

2273
01:49:35,510 --> 01:49:33,150
interested in is called the hypo coddled

2274
01:49:37,010 --> 01:49:35,520
this is the distance between the top of

2275
01:49:39,890 --> 01:49:37,020
the seed and the bottom of where the

2276
01:49:42,830 --> 01:49:39,900
first leaves show up it's like the stem

2277
01:49:46,430 --> 01:49:42,840
of the seed so a really strong

2278
01:49:49,550 --> 01:49:46,440
healthy seed will have a short fat hypo

2279
01:49:51,590 --> 01:49:49,560
coddled and that means that it's it's

2280
01:49:53,750 --> 01:49:51,600
going to stand up strong it's not

2281
01:49:56,570 --> 01:49:53,760
wasting too much energy by making a very

2282
01:49:59,200 --> 01:49:56,580
long stem because if you plant the seed

2283
01:50:01,910 --> 01:49:59,210
upside down for example it starts going

2284
01:50:03,650 --> 01:50:01,920
towards urge it has to turn around so

2285
01:50:05,360 --> 01:50:03,660
takes a lot more energy to do that you

2286
01:50:08,630 --> 01:50:05,370
end up with a much longer hypo coddled

2287
01:50:11,180 --> 01:50:08,640
or if there's not enough light it has to

2288
01:50:13,640 --> 01:50:11,190
stretch to find some light so we're

2289
01:50:17,180 --> 01:50:13,650
looking for short fat hypo Cottle's and

2290
01:50:18,860 --> 01:50:17,190
the Blessed seeds and and something else

2291
01:50:21,260 --> 01:50:18,870
and the non bless seeds and that's what

2292
01:50:22,850 --> 01:50:21,270
we found ended up doing four experiments

2293
01:50:25,880 --> 01:50:22,860
each experiment was replicated three

2294
01:50:30,140 --> 01:50:25,890
times and overall there was no question

2295
01:50:33,610 --> 01:50:30,150
at all that the Blessed seeds grew much

2296
01:50:37,520 --> 01:50:33,620
better than the unblessed seeds now how

2297
01:50:39,340 --> 01:50:37,530
could you because our bodies are what

2298
01:50:42,110 --> 01:50:39,350
ninety ninety five percent water

2299
01:50:45,560 --> 01:50:42,120
what our babies but for adults more like

2300
01:50:50,030 --> 01:50:45,570
75 okay 75 good enough for me yep right

2301
01:50:52,520 --> 01:50:50,040
how could we use that to affect us well

2302
01:50:53,750 --> 01:50:52,530
if you are drinking Blessed water with

2303
01:50:55,880 --> 01:50:53,760
the right kind of blessing then

2304
01:50:58,280 --> 01:50:55,890
presumably it would help you in terms of

2305
01:51:00,250 --> 01:50:58,290
your health no I and what about blessing

2306
01:51:02,990 --> 01:51:00,260
the water that is already inside of us

2307
01:51:06,050 --> 01:51:03,000
well that too in fact this is one of the

2308
01:51:08,990 --> 01:51:06,060
ways that it is thought that psychic

2309
01:51:10,910 --> 01:51:09,000
healing might work that it is changing

2310
01:51:14,270 --> 01:51:10,920
the nature of the water inside of you I

2311
01:51:17,120 --> 01:51:14,280
mean I find that exciting I've often

2312
01:51:20,120 --> 01:51:17,130
thought about that you know we are if we

2313
01:51:22,760 --> 01:51:20,130
can't affect water and here our bodies

2314
01:51:24,650 --> 01:51:22,770
are you know 75 percent water for

2315
01:51:26,750 --> 01:51:24,660
instance well then we could definitely

2316
01:51:28,850 --> 01:51:26,760
change our moods we could do a lot of

2317
01:51:31,700 --> 01:51:28,860
things you could do a lot of things yeah

2318
01:51:34,190 --> 01:51:31,710
yeah absolutely so we use the plants

2319
01:51:36,320 --> 01:51:34,200
again kind of as an analogue for human

2320
01:51:39,260 --> 01:51:36,330
health just simply to see whether

2321
01:51:41,000 --> 01:51:39,270
whether it would do anything well so we

2322
01:51:44,870 --> 01:51:41,010
have pretty good evidence and it'll do

2323
01:51:46,400 --> 01:51:44,880
something it does something big so and

2324
01:51:48,650 --> 01:51:46,410
and of course it's in this case its

2325
01:51:51,020 --> 01:51:48,660
macroscopic we're taking a seed and

2326
01:51:52,760 --> 01:51:51,030
growing the seed and seeing an effect

2327
01:51:55,850 --> 01:51:52,770
which you can see with your naked eye

2328
01:51:56,419 --> 01:51:55,860
but the underlying effect we think is

2329
01:51:58,699 --> 01:51:56,429
really

2330
01:52:00,500 --> 01:51:58,709
subtle it's a tiny little effect but it

2331
01:52:03,890 --> 01:52:00,510
just is amplified by the the growth of

2332
01:52:06,319 --> 01:52:03,900
the receipt itself no so you did you

2333
01:52:09,529 --> 01:52:06,329
repeated the you did four experiments

2334
01:52:14,839 --> 01:52:09,539
repeated it three times well where were

2335
01:52:16,520 --> 01:52:14,849
you at for success 100% 90% oh well we

2336
01:52:18,350 --> 01:52:16,530
look at it in terms of the overall

2337
01:52:20,779 --> 01:52:18,360
probability of the distant of the

2338
01:52:24,709 --> 01:52:20,789
difference between the treated and non

2339
01:52:26,929 --> 01:52:24,719
treated seeds and it's related to you

2340
01:52:28,850 --> 01:52:26,939
get an average length of the hypotenuse

2341
01:52:30,410 --> 01:52:28,860
for the blessed ones and for the non

2342
01:52:33,589 --> 01:52:30,420
blessed ones I forget exactly what the

2343
01:52:36,169 --> 01:52:33,599
difference was and absolute terms but

2344
01:52:38,540 --> 01:52:36,179
from a probabilistic perspective it was

2345
01:52:41,000 --> 01:52:38,550
it was trillions to one against chance

2346
01:52:43,520 --> 01:52:41,010
so there's there basically no question

2347
01:52:46,219 --> 01:52:43,530
that the seeds grew in a different way

2348
01:52:50,359 --> 01:52:46,229
now what about when we're dealing with

2349
01:52:53,000 --> 01:52:50,369
you know the mind or trying to sense or

2350
01:52:54,199 --> 01:52:53,010
communicate with somebody you know over

2351
01:52:56,449 --> 01:52:54,209
great distances

2352
01:52:59,660 --> 01:52:56,459
how how do you set up that type of

2353
01:53:02,479 --> 01:52:59,670
experiment and you know take that into

2354
01:53:06,500 --> 01:53:02,489
hardcore science you mean for telepathy

2355
01:53:08,959 --> 01:53:06,510
experiment yes so the classic form of

2356
01:53:11,270 --> 01:53:08,969
telepathy experiment is called the

2357
01:53:15,350 --> 01:53:11,280
ganzfeld experiment Khan's Feld is a

2358
01:53:20,149 --> 01:53:15,360
German word meaning whole field and is

2359
01:53:23,509 --> 01:53:20,159
actually the the way manifests is a nun

2360
01:53:25,219 --> 01:53:23,519
patterned sensory stimulus so that

2361
01:53:27,069 --> 01:53:25,229
sounds very fancy but all it really

2362
01:53:29,479 --> 01:53:27,079
means as you sit in the comfy chair

2363
01:53:33,500 --> 01:53:29,489
you'll have a half of a ping-pong ball

2364
01:53:35,779 --> 01:53:33,510
put over each eye it's taped down you

2365
01:53:38,299 --> 01:53:35,789
keep your eyes open and then we shine a

2366
01:53:40,910 --> 01:53:38,309
red light in your face so with your eyes

2367
01:53:43,250 --> 01:53:40,920
open anywhere you look you only see a

2368
01:53:45,350 --> 01:53:43,260
kind of a pink color and then we put

2369
01:53:47,509 --> 01:53:45,360
headphones on that are playing white

2370
01:53:49,310 --> 01:53:47,519
noise so you can't hear anything and

2371
01:53:52,939 --> 01:53:49,320
can't see anything you're not sleeping

2372
01:53:54,560 --> 01:53:52,949
and the because of the pattern stimulus

2373
01:53:56,989 --> 01:53:54,570
in your ears and your eyes are open you

2374
01:53:58,969 --> 01:53:56,999
don't really fall asleep either what

2375
01:54:01,640 --> 01:53:58,979
happens is you go pretty quickly within

2376
01:54:04,729 --> 01:54:01,650
a couple of minutes into the state like

2377
01:54:06,739 --> 01:54:04,739
a hypnagogic state that's the state that

2378
01:54:08,750 --> 01:54:06,749
just when you're falling asleep you

2379
01:54:09,600 --> 01:54:08,760
start having images come they could be

2380
01:54:12,600 --> 01:54:09,610
very vivid

2381
01:54:16,500 --> 01:54:12,610
and this gun's Feld condition stimulates

2382
01:54:17,880 --> 01:54:16,510
that so you think of it as after a

2383
01:54:20,910 --> 01:54:17,890
couple of minutes of this uniform

2384
01:54:23,850 --> 01:54:20,920
background stimulation you become

2385
01:54:25,560 --> 01:54:23,860
starved for something different and so

2386
01:54:27,630 --> 01:54:25,570
you become really really sensitive to

2387
01:54:30,210 --> 01:54:27,640
any kind of impression that's that's

2388
01:54:31,530 --> 01:54:30,220
coming internally or externally so

2389
01:54:33,450 --> 01:54:31,540
that's the person who will play the role

2390
01:54:38,160 --> 01:54:33,460
of the receiver in a telepathy

2391
01:54:40,860 --> 01:54:38,170
experiment got it now remote located at

2392
01:54:45,300 --> 01:54:40,870
a distant place and shielded from this

2393
01:54:48,630 --> 01:54:45,310
receiver the experimenter hands the

2394
01:54:50,610 --> 01:54:48,640
sender a randomly selected picture it's

2395
01:54:53,460 --> 01:54:50,620
typically one picture out of a pool of

2396
01:54:55,400 --> 01:54:53,470
four possible pictures so they give them

2397
01:54:57,900 --> 01:54:55,410
one that was selected at random

2398
01:54:59,520 --> 01:54:57,910
neither the sender or receiver had any

2399
01:55:03,060 --> 01:54:59,530
idea in advance what that picture would

2400
01:55:05,850 --> 01:55:03,070
be but the sender is task is to mentally

2401
01:55:08,430 --> 01:55:05,860
send that information to the receiver in

2402
01:55:10,230 --> 01:55:08,440
some designs you have the receivers

2403
01:55:12,450 --> 01:55:10,240
speak aloud anything that comes to mind

2404
01:55:15,270 --> 01:55:12,460
any kind of impression and you take a

2405
01:55:16,470 --> 01:55:15,280
one-way audio link from the receiver

2406
01:55:18,840 --> 01:55:16,480
back to the sender

2407
01:55:20,460 --> 01:55:18,850
so whatever the sender is doing mentally

2408
01:55:24,600 --> 01:55:20,470
to try to send the information they can

2409
01:55:26,160 --> 01:55:24,610
hear the receiver speaking aloud so they

2410
01:55:28,950 --> 01:55:26,170
can kind of adjust their sending

2411
01:55:30,530 --> 01:55:28,960
strategy to help the receiver get the

2412
01:55:34,170 --> 01:55:30,540
information that they're trying to send

2413
01:55:36,060 --> 01:55:34,180
so what I just described is would take

2414
01:55:38,280 --> 01:55:36,070
three or four people to do the

2415
01:55:40,620 --> 01:55:38,290
experiment to two subjects a couple of

2416
01:55:43,010 --> 01:55:40,630
experimenters it might take 90 minutes

2417
01:55:46,950 --> 01:55:43,020
for the whole experiment to take place

2418
01:55:48,930 --> 01:55:46,960
the receiver after 20 minutes of sending

2419
01:55:52,110 --> 01:55:48,940
the receivers taken out of the ganzfeld

2420
01:55:53,460 --> 01:55:52,120
condition is shown four pictures one of

2421
01:55:55,590 --> 01:55:53,470
which was the one that the sender was

2422
01:55:58,920 --> 01:55:55,600
trying to send along with three decoys

2423
01:56:01,710 --> 01:55:58,930
and so the the receivers job then is to

2424
01:56:03,390 --> 01:56:01,720
select based on their impressions which

2425
01:56:05,850 --> 01:56:03,400
of the four pictures they thought was

2426
01:56:07,710 --> 01:56:05,860
being sent to them so by chance you'd

2427
01:56:10,500 --> 01:56:07,720
get it one in four times surety five

2428
01:56:13,070 --> 01:56:10,510
percent right what we see after more

2429
01:56:15,450 --> 01:56:13,080
than four thousand sessions of this type

2430
01:56:19,520 --> 01:56:15,460
conducted in over 20 labs around the

2431
01:56:21,810 --> 01:56:19,530
world is 32 percent so rather than

2432
01:56:22,590 --> 01:56:21,820
getting it correct one in four times

2433
01:56:25,260 --> 01:56:22,600
it's

2434
01:56:26,640 --> 01:56:25,270
correct about one in three times well

2435
01:56:29,010 --> 01:56:26,650
that doesn't sound very good until you

2436
01:56:31,230 --> 01:56:29,020
do the statistics on this to find out

2437
01:56:34,260 --> 01:56:31,240
well is this the is this due to chance

2438
01:56:36,300 --> 01:56:34,270
or not well no it's not due to chance

2439
01:56:38,610 --> 01:56:36,310
the odds against chance are beyond the

2440
01:56:42,540 --> 01:56:38,620
quadrillion to one a thousand trillion

2441
01:56:46,980 --> 01:56:42,550
to one that you would get a 32% hit rate

2442
01:56:48,810 --> 01:56:46,990
when 25% is chance so that that's how

2443
01:56:50,700 --> 01:56:48,820
you can tell under very rigorous

2444
01:56:52,860 --> 01:56:50,710
conditions with a very simple

2445
01:56:55,590 --> 01:56:52,870
statistical method that people are

2446
01:56:56,940 --> 01:56:55,600
getting more information the receiver is

2447
01:56:59,610 --> 01:56:56,950
getting more information than they

2448
01:57:01,800 --> 01:56:59,620
should if all they were doing was simply

2449
01:57:04,710 --> 01:57:01,810
selecting a picture a chance and what

2450
01:57:06,570 --> 01:57:04,720
about taking it to another level where

2451
01:57:10,680 --> 01:57:06,580
they're not actually picking the picture

2452
01:57:14,580 --> 01:57:10,690
but they would have to draw what they

2453
01:57:17,250 --> 01:57:14,590
were hopefully seeing or feeling that

2454
01:57:19,890 --> 01:57:17,260
would be closer to a remote viewing

2455
01:57:23,220 --> 01:57:19,900
experiment right right remote the

2456
01:57:25,470 --> 01:57:23,230
experiment differs because typically

2457
01:57:27,870 --> 01:57:25,480
they're you you don't get to see four

2458
01:57:30,870 --> 01:57:27,880
pictures at the end you only get to see

2459
01:57:33,120 --> 01:57:30,880
the final result the one result right

2460
01:57:35,880 --> 01:57:33,130
and also remote viewing involves

2461
01:57:38,070 --> 01:57:35,890
sketching so you would sketch you try to

2462
01:57:40,320 --> 01:57:38,080
get your internal impressions and sketch

2463
01:57:42,870 --> 01:57:40,330
it or miss sometimes use words on a

2464
01:57:45,600 --> 01:57:42,880
piece of paper that piece of paper then

2465
01:57:47,970 --> 01:57:45,610
is given to a judge now the judge might

2466
01:57:51,060 --> 01:57:47,980
see the actual target and a couple of

2467
01:57:52,920 --> 01:57:51,070
other targets but the remote viewer

2468
01:57:55,020 --> 01:57:52,930
typically doesn't because you don't want

2469
01:57:57,000 --> 01:57:55,030
to confuse the remote viewer with in

2470
01:57:59,220 --> 01:57:57,010
their future seeing multiple targets

2471
01:58:01,950 --> 01:57:59,230
they should only see the one target that

2472
01:58:04,650 --> 01:58:01,960
is the real one are you born not too

2473
01:58:07,340 --> 01:58:04,660
specifically Dean but is one born a

2474
01:58:12,330 --> 01:58:07,350
remote viewer or is this something that

2475
01:58:15,080 --> 01:58:12,340
actually could be taught there's

2476
01:58:17,940 --> 01:58:15,090
definitely a talent associated with this

2477
01:58:20,790 --> 01:58:17,950
the talent seems to run in families so

2478
01:58:22,740 --> 01:58:20,800
there's probably a genetic basis but

2479
01:58:24,120 --> 01:58:22,750
everybody can learn to some degree in

2480
01:58:26,520 --> 01:58:24,130
the same sense that everybody can learn

2481
01:58:28,230 --> 01:58:26,530
how to play tennis to some degree but

2482
01:58:31,860 --> 01:58:28,240
not everybody is going to become a

2483
01:58:36,130 --> 01:58:31,870
professional tennis player i remote

2484
01:58:38,380 --> 01:58:36,140
viewing out of all of these

2485
01:58:40,420 --> 01:58:38,390
talents remote viewing is the one thing

2486
01:58:41,830 --> 01:58:40,430
that probably freaks me out the most and

2487
01:58:45,280 --> 01:58:41,840
I can't think of another word to use

2488
01:58:47,110 --> 01:58:45,290
when I see it done in real time and I

2489
01:58:51,780 --> 01:58:47,120
see the results and I see the targets

2490
01:58:54,160 --> 01:58:51,790
it's pretty astounding to me I that is

2491
01:58:56,470 --> 01:58:54,170
as it's something that I can't express

2492
01:58:59,500 --> 01:58:56,480
or put into words it really really

2493
01:59:01,300 --> 01:58:59,510
freaks me out yeah and the freak out is

2494
01:59:03,370 --> 01:59:01,310
exactly one of the reasons why this

2495
01:59:06,070 --> 01:59:03,380
topic is considered to be so

2496
01:59:08,110 --> 01:59:06,080
controversial it's it's partially to

2497
01:59:09,640 --> 01:59:08,120
freaked out because it doesn't seem like

2498
01:59:13,480 --> 01:59:09,650
we're struggling to figure out how can

2499
01:59:15,760 --> 01:59:13,490
this be it's also that it we don't see

2500
01:59:19,210 --> 01:59:15,770
high-level talent of this type very

2501
01:59:22,060 --> 01:59:19,220
often but by the same token there are

2502
01:59:25,120 --> 01:59:22,070
people who run ultra marathons like they

2503
01:59:30,490 --> 01:59:25,130
can run 24 hours in a row and at a rate

2504
01:59:34,300 --> 01:59:30,500
of like 5 miles per hour that's crazy

2505
01:59:36,730 --> 01:59:34,310
that freaks me out I mean occasionally

2506
01:59:39,250 --> 01:59:36,740
on TV you watch one of these CrossFit

2507
01:59:41,200 --> 01:59:39,260
training things yes where there's a

2508
01:59:44,530 --> 01:59:41,210
competition well those people are not

2509
01:59:48,550 --> 01:59:44,540
normal right yes certainly the exception

2510
01:59:50,410 --> 01:59:48,560
and what let's let's take a break right

2511
01:59:52,270 --> 01:59:50,420
here we've got so much more to discuss

2512
01:59:54,790 --> 01:59:52,280
and we're quickly running out of time

2513
01:59:57,360 --> 01:59:54,800
our guest tonight is Dean Radin we're

2514
02:00:00,580 --> 01:59:57,370
discussing his new book real magic and

2515
02:00:02,590 --> 02:00:00,590
let's just do what we're doing and doing

2516
02:00:04,090 --> 02:00:02,600
it best let's pick up where we left off

2517
02:00:06,520 --> 02:00:04,100
right after this short break I'm going

2518
02:00:08,090 --> 02:00:06,530
to be Church more with Dean Radin

2519
02:00:17,240 --> 02:00:08,100
right after this stay with us

2520
02:00:24,419 --> 02:00:17,250
[Music]

2521
02:00:27,450 --> 02:00:24,429
Jimmy Church radio calm this is kera

2522
02:00:31,140 --> 02:00:27,460
digital broadcasting station Salt Lake

2523
02:00:33,120 --> 02:00:31,150
City Utah Van Buren Arkansas poor water

2524
02:00:34,280 --> 02:00:33,130
quality is a major health issue and it's

2525
02:00:36,660 --> 02:00:34,290
only getting worse

2526
02:00:38,129 --> 02:00:36,670
municipalities can't keep up standards

2527
02:00:41,280 --> 02:00:38,139
have dropped and pollutants are

2528
02:00:43,080 --> 02:00:41,290
increasing where does it all end it ends

2529
02:00:44,790 --> 02:00:43,090
by keeping the pollutants outside of

2530
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your home with hydro cares advanced

2531
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2532
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2533
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2534
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developed by hydro care to provide you

2535
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with healthy clean water for drinking

2536
02:00:59,129 --> 02:00:57,190
cooking and showering hydro care far

2537
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surpasses the competition in removing

2538
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2539
02:01:05,760 --> 02:01:03,310
limescale

2540
02:01:07,649 --> 02:01:05,770
and much more don't settle for less when

2541
02:01:09,419 --> 02:01:07,659
it comes to your water we'll take care

2542
02:01:11,689 --> 02:01:09,429
of the toughest water problems for you

2543
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whether it's from a city or well source

2544
02:01:15,870 --> 02:01:13,869
satisfaction guaranteed for more

2545
02:01:17,790 --> 02:01:15,880
information call eight eight eight nine

2546
02:01:21,180 --> 02:01:17,800
nine seven wave that's eight eight eight

2547
02:01:23,459 --> 02:01:21,190
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2548
02:01:26,290 --> 02:01:23,469
water one two three dot-com that's best

2549
02:01:27,180 --> 02:01:26,300
water one two three dot-com

2550
02:01:30,280 --> 02:01:27,190
Solutions

2551
02:01:33,050 --> 02:01:30,290
[Music]

2552
02:01:37,490 --> 02:01:33,060
your contact for current news and

2553
02:01:39,290 --> 02:01:37,500
trending topics je GRA radio.com does

2554
02:01:41,660 --> 02:01:39,300
your basement or crawlspace have a damp

2555
02:01:43,430 --> 02:01:41,670
musty smell well watch out that's a sign

2556
02:01:45,260 --> 02:01:43,440
of too much moisture and not enough

2557
02:01:47,209 --> 02:01:45,270
ventilation and that can mean increased

2558
02:01:49,160 --> 02:01:47,219
mold growth and the build-up of harmful

2559
02:01:51,410 --> 02:01:49,170
toxins and gases don't bother with a

2560
02:01:53,720 --> 02:01:51,420
dehumidifier it just circulates the same

2561
02:01:55,970 --> 02:01:53,730
unhealthy air now there's a better way

2562
02:01:57,950 --> 02:01:55,980
to remove these dangers and odors it's

2563
02:02:00,080 --> 02:01:57,960
with the computerized wave moisture

2564
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control unit that reduces moisture and

2565
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expels pollutants we replaced our old

2566
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2567
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only three weeks our basement is dry and

2568
02:02:10,340 --> 02:02:08,190
the musty smell is gone

2569
02:02:12,590 --> 02:02:10,350
wave units require no maintenance no

2570
02:02:14,780 --> 02:02:12,600
buckets of water or filters and costs

2571
02:02:16,939 --> 02:02:14,790
only pennies a day to run breathe better

2572
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2573
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eight seven one seven way eight eight

2575
02:02:37,150 --> 02:02:33,600
own solutions

2576
02:02:42,860 --> 02:02:39,560
this is Jimmy church' fade to black

2577
02:02:46,280 --> 02:02:42,870
and I only drink fade to black blend

2578
02:02:48,500 --> 02:02:46,290
coffee from River Moon just click on the

2579
02:02:53,330 --> 02:02:48,510
river moon coffee banner at Jimmy Church

2580
02:02:55,760 --> 02:02:53,340
radio.com promo code f2 b blend so are

2581
02:02:58,640 --> 02:02:55,770
you tired of being tired well then it's

2582
02:03:00,440 --> 02:02:58,650
time to get the tea hey it's Lisa here

2583
02:03:02,960 --> 02:03:00,450
to tell you about this all-natural all

2584
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organic tea I've been drinking that has

2585
02:03:07,850 --> 02:03:04,920
had great results for over 20 years

2586
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it's called life changed tea and it's

2587
02:03:12,290 --> 02:03:09,690
specially formulated to help detoxify

2588
02:03:14,990 --> 02:03:12,300
and cleanse your kidneys liver colon and

2589
02:03:16,370 --> 02:03:15,000
blood all at once the colon is one of

2590
02:03:19,130 --> 02:03:16,380
the most ignored organs in the human

2591
02:03:20,960 --> 02:03:19,140
body the faster that waste is eliminated

2592
02:03:22,970 --> 02:03:20,970
from the body the less time that way

2593
02:03:24,920 --> 02:03:22,980
sits in our intestines spreading toxins

2594
02:03:26,840 --> 02:03:24,930
to our bloodstream this tea helps

2595
02:03:29,060 --> 02:03:26,850
cleanse chemicals caused by outside

2596
02:03:31,760 --> 02:03:29,070
intruders from our entire digestive

2597
02:03:34,070 --> 02:03:31,770
system and get this weight loss can be a

2598
02:03:36,290 --> 02:03:34,080
side effect and with continued use of

2599
02:03:38,720 --> 02:03:36,300
the tea you can experience clearer

2600
02:03:41,390 --> 02:03:38,730
healthier younger looking skin increased

2601
02:03:42,800 --> 02:03:41,400
energy and a happier outlook on life so

2602
02:03:45,680 --> 02:03:42,810
if you're tired of being tired

2603
02:03:46,490 --> 02:03:45,690
get the life change tea at get the tea

2604
02:03:52,490 --> 02:03:46,500
calm

2605
02:03:54,230 --> 02:03:52,500
you'll be glad you did did you know that

2606
02:03:56,540 --> 02:03:54,240
when you're on the road with limited

2607
02:03:58,460 --> 02:03:56,550
data or Wi-Fi available you can still

2608
02:04:01,220 --> 02:03:58,470
listen to every minute of fade to black

2609
02:04:04,340 --> 02:04:01,230
by just calling six oh five five six two

2610
02:04:06,620 --> 02:04:04,350
four four eight two no smartphone app or

2611
02:04:08,900 --> 02:04:06,630
Internet needed it saves your data plan

2612
02:04:12,260 --> 02:04:08,910
and no extra cost if you have unlimited

2613
02:04:14,540 --> 02:04:12,270
minutes just call six oh five five six

2614
02:04:17,000 --> 02:04:14,550
two four four eight two you can listen

2615
02:04:24,850 --> 02:04:17,010
to me Jimmy Church on any phone anytime

2616
02:04:24,860 --> 02:04:28,890
[Music]

2617
02:04:35,290 --> 02:04:31,029
you want to know a secret

2618
02:04:38,229 --> 02:04:35,300
I love ponies I really love ponies I'm

2619
02:04:41,770 --> 02:04:38,239
serious I couldn't stay sane without

2620
02:04:48,000 --> 02:04:41,780
poor mr. Brooks why fade to black

2621
02:04:52,000 --> 02:04:49,870
this is fade to black

2622
02:04:55,689 --> 02:04:52,010
with Jimmy Church on the game changer

2623
02:04:58,070 --> 02:04:55,699
radio network and kgr a the global radio

2624
02:05:09,870 --> 02:04:58,080
alliance

2625
02:05:12,160 --> 02:05:09,880
[Music]

2626
02:05:15,580 --> 02:05:12,170
welcome back fade to black I'm use to my

2627
02:05:18,490 --> 02:05:15,590
church follow me on twitter @ JT radio

2628
02:05:24,760 --> 02:05:18,500
you can follow Dean at Dean Radin on

2629
02:05:27,250 --> 02:05:24,770
Twitter our a bi n email is Jimmy and

2630
02:05:30,430 --> 02:05:27,260
Jimmy Church radio calm lots of great

2631
02:05:33,520 --> 02:05:30,440
insights going on here in Twitter and

2632
02:05:36,250 --> 02:05:33,530
Dean before we move on I've got a couple

2633
02:05:39,040 --> 02:05:36,260
of questions this is from Steven and he

2634
02:05:42,189 --> 02:05:39,050
says I'd love to hear Dean Raiden's take

2635
02:05:45,870 --> 02:05:42,199
on the meta-analysis study released in

2636
02:05:50,560 --> 02:05:45,880
May on Paris psychological phenomenon

2637
02:05:53,350 --> 02:05:50,570
mm-hmm so this might refer to an article

2638
02:05:56,229 --> 02:05:53,360
in a journal called American

2639
02:05:58,959 --> 02:05:56,239
psychologist American psychologist is

2640
02:06:01,240 --> 02:05:58,969
the flagship journal of the American

2641
02:06:04,050 --> 02:06:01,250
Psychological Association which is a

2642
02:06:06,640 --> 02:06:04,060
hundred and twenty thousand academic

2643
02:06:08,979 --> 02:06:06,650
psychologists and clinical psychologists

2644
02:06:12,370 --> 02:06:08,989
so it's it's a big deal in the

2645
02:06:14,290 --> 02:06:12,380
psychological world this was an article

2646
02:06:16,689 --> 02:06:14,300
by a colleague named Etzel giardiniera

2647
02:06:19,330 --> 02:06:16,699
who's a professor at the university in

2648
02:06:24,669 --> 02:06:19,340
sweden and it's a lead article talking

2649
02:06:27,280 --> 02:06:24,679
about ten classes of psychic experiments

2650
02:06:30,220 --> 02:06:27,290
like we discussed one about telepathy

2651
02:06:31,780 --> 02:06:30,230
and there's one about psychokinesis but

2652
02:06:35,890 --> 02:06:31,790
there's eight other classes of

2653
02:06:39,970 --> 02:06:35,900
experiments and basically he concludes

2654
02:06:42,370 --> 02:06:39,980
that the overall evidence for for the

2655
02:06:45,850 --> 02:06:42,380
existence of these phenomena is is

2656
02:06:48,910 --> 02:06:45,860
overwhelming positive so this is

2657
02:06:51,100 --> 02:06:48,920
important partially because he it the

2658
02:06:54,580 --> 02:06:51,110
article appeared it appeared in a major

2659
02:06:57,340 --> 02:06:54,590
psychology journal and also that it

2660
02:07:00,459 --> 02:06:57,350
appeared in a positive way because what

2661
02:07:03,010 --> 02:07:00,469
what often happens in journals is that

2662
02:07:05,350 --> 02:07:03,020
it's okay for an academic to publish an

2663
02:07:08,109 --> 02:07:05,360
article which shows no effect because

2664
02:07:10,540 --> 02:07:08,119
that matches the mainstream idea about

2665
02:07:12,250 --> 02:07:10,550
what's what's going on here so it's

2666
02:07:14,830 --> 02:07:12,260
fairly easy to publish a negative

2667
02:07:17,350 --> 02:07:14,840
article it's been very very difficult to

2668
02:07:21,160 --> 02:07:17,360
publish a positive article and this

2669
02:07:22,780 --> 02:07:21,170
disorder was very positive so it's one

2670
02:07:25,090 --> 02:07:22,790
of a number of signs

2671
02:07:28,210 --> 02:07:25,100
that I think is showing that there's a

2672
02:07:30,670 --> 02:07:28,220
loosening of the prejudices in the past

2673
02:07:32,380 --> 02:07:30,680
within the scientific community that is

2674
02:07:34,360 --> 02:07:32,390
at least allowing people to now discuss

2675
02:07:36,550 --> 02:07:34,370
these ideas without immediately

2676
02:07:38,950 --> 02:07:36,560
dismissing them and that's that's a big

2677
02:07:40,260 --> 02:07:38,960
change and what was the analysis that

2678
02:07:44,260 --> 02:07:40,270
was used

2679
02:07:46,210 --> 02:07:44,270
well meta-analysis is a statistical

2680
02:07:48,730 --> 02:07:46,220
technique to integrate the results of

2681
02:07:50,290 --> 02:07:48,740
many repeated experiments because for

2682
02:07:52,990 --> 02:07:50,300
example if we did one telepathy

2683
02:07:54,160 --> 02:07:53,000
experiment with one session and the

2684
02:07:55,420 --> 02:07:54,170
person got it right

2685
02:07:57,880 --> 02:07:55,430
you're not going to conclude that

2686
02:07:59,260 --> 02:07:57,890
telepathy exists because by chance they

2687
02:08:02,230 --> 02:07:59,270
could have gotten it right one in four

2688
02:08:04,180 --> 02:08:02,240
times so you do the experiment and then

2689
02:08:05,650 --> 02:08:04,190
you might get a good result and you're

2690
02:08:07,570 --> 02:08:05,660
not sure you believe it so you do it

2691
02:08:09,580 --> 02:08:07,580
again and you do it again and you keep

2692
02:08:12,640 --> 02:08:09,590
doing it again as I said we it's been

2693
02:08:15,730 --> 02:08:12,650
done over 4,000 times and all of that is

2694
02:08:18,690 --> 02:08:15,740
is gaining confidence about the overall

2695
02:08:21,520 --> 02:08:18,700
result so the meta-analysis is an

2696
02:08:24,070 --> 02:08:21,530
analysis of analyses that's what the

2697
02:08:25,630 --> 02:08:24,080
meta part means right and it's a way of

2698
02:08:27,670 --> 02:08:25,640
assessing whether or not the is this

2699
02:08:30,310 --> 02:08:27,680
really a repeatable effect that

2700
02:08:32,410 --> 02:08:30,320
independent people can get or not well

2701
02:08:35,620 --> 02:08:32,420
that this method that's been developed

2702
02:08:38,110 --> 02:08:35,630
now for a couple of decades has become

2703
02:08:41,050 --> 02:08:38,120
better and better at being able to

2704
02:08:44,290 --> 02:08:41,060
analyze whether the effect is repeatable

2705
02:08:46,660 --> 02:08:44,300
which is the currency in science and so

2706
02:08:49,330 --> 02:08:46,670
there's ten classes of psychic

2707
02:08:54,520 --> 02:08:49,340
experiments that are now repeatable why

2708
02:08:58,440 --> 02:08:54,530
is it you know this type of testing and

2709
02:09:01,690 --> 02:08:58,450
study on the cover of Time magazine

2710
02:09:03,100 --> 02:09:01,700
right yeah I mean this is this is a

2711
02:09:05,410 --> 02:09:03,110
breakthrough and this is something that

2712
02:09:07,510 --> 02:09:05,420
we've all that the entire planets been

2713
02:09:09,640 --> 02:09:07,520
fascinated with for thousands of years

2714
02:09:12,340 --> 02:09:09,650
and we have a breakthrough study like

2715
02:09:15,430 --> 02:09:12,350
this I would think that Wolf Blitzer

2716
02:09:17,620 --> 02:09:15,440
would be talking about it yeah you think

2717
02:09:20,230 --> 02:09:17,630
so wouldn't you but as you already

2718
02:09:23,380 --> 02:09:20,240
mentioned that the notion that remote

2719
02:09:25,240 --> 02:09:23,390
viewing is real freaks you out and it

2720
02:09:28,900 --> 02:09:25,250
freaks a lot of people out right right

2721
02:09:30,640 --> 02:09:28,910
because we each of us build up a common

2722
02:09:31,150 --> 02:09:30,650
sense notion of how we think the world

2723
02:09:33,520 --> 02:09:31,160
works

2724
02:09:36,319 --> 02:09:33,530
and these phenomena strongly challenge

2725
02:09:38,330 --> 02:09:36,329
that but it doesn't challenge

2726
02:09:40,189 --> 02:09:38,340
to much more than if you really

2727
02:09:42,620 --> 02:09:40,199
understood what's going on in quantum

2728
02:09:45,140 --> 02:09:42,630
mechanics because these phenomena are

2729
02:09:46,850 --> 02:09:45,150
actually quite compatible with the with

2730
02:09:49,459 --> 02:09:46,860
the reality suggested by quantum

2731
02:09:51,439 --> 02:09:49,469
mechanics but quantum mechanics is not

2732
02:09:54,229 --> 02:09:51,449
part of everyday experience you know we

2733
02:09:57,500 --> 02:09:54,239
can't see at the subatomic level but in

2734
02:09:59,359 --> 02:09:57,510
experiments we can and we see all kinds

2735
02:10:03,200 --> 02:09:59,369
of very weird stuff going on that is not

2736
02:10:05,000 --> 02:10:03,210
common sense at all so anytime something

2737
02:10:07,129 --> 02:10:05,010
challenges common sense it's not

2738
02:10:09,709 --> 02:10:07,139
surprising that people will say that's

2739
02:10:12,319 --> 02:10:09,719
ridiculous they can't possibly be even

2740
02:10:13,970 --> 02:10:12,329
though it is we're gonna get to quantum

2741
02:10:15,140 --> 02:10:13,980
mechanics here in just a second but

2742
02:10:18,770 --> 02:10:15,150
Cassandra

2743
02:10:24,109 --> 02:10:18,780
this is great she says any thoughts on

2744
02:10:26,000 --> 02:10:24,119
how dowsing divining rods work yeah I

2745
02:10:27,680 --> 02:10:26,010
was just discussing that today with

2746
02:10:29,359 --> 02:10:27,690
somebody who I know is a very good to

2747
02:10:31,669 --> 02:10:29,369
house her okay you know what I'm gonna

2748
02:10:36,100 --> 02:10:31,679
jump in and tell you that my wife and I

2749
02:10:38,720 --> 02:10:36,110
were talking about this last night okay

2750
02:10:43,370 --> 02:10:38,730
it's a topic whose time has come

2751
02:10:45,709 --> 02:10:43,380
yes the current theory is that some of

2752
02:10:47,870 --> 02:10:45,719
it might be psychic especially what's

2753
02:10:48,919 --> 02:10:47,880
called map dowsing right if you're

2754
02:10:51,740 --> 02:10:48,929
trying to find a missing object

2755
02:10:53,810 --> 02:10:51,750
somewhere and you only have a map and

2756
02:10:56,149 --> 02:10:53,820
you're dowsing over the map and you're

2757
02:10:58,129 --> 02:10:56,159
nowhere near the actual site well that's

2758
02:11:00,709 --> 02:10:58,139
got to be psychic that's a kind of

2759
02:11:03,109 --> 02:11:00,719
remote viewing mm-hmm if you're in a

2760
02:11:04,970 --> 02:11:03,119
field and you're dowsing for water or

2761
02:11:07,549 --> 02:11:04,980
minerals or something then there's a lot

2762
02:11:09,500 --> 02:11:07,559
of other possibilities that we know that

2763
02:11:11,270 --> 02:11:09,510
humans are sensitive to magnetic fields

2764
02:11:13,280 --> 02:11:11,280
we know that the Earth's magnetic field

2765
02:11:15,379 --> 02:11:13,290
saturates everything on the planet and

2766
02:11:18,350 --> 02:11:15,389
so maybe some people are just naturally

2767
02:11:20,510 --> 02:11:18,360
very sensitive to distortions in the

2768
02:11:24,069 --> 02:11:20,520
lines of force and so they can tell that

2769
02:11:26,149 --> 02:11:24,079
there's like a vein of water or or

2770
02:11:28,399 --> 02:11:26,159
underneath where they are because they

2771
02:11:32,240 --> 02:11:28,409
feel a shift in the magnetic lines of

2772
02:11:35,209 --> 02:11:32,250
force so that's possible and and because

2773
02:11:39,020 --> 02:11:35,219
there are many possible explanations we

2774
02:11:41,060 --> 02:11:39,030
we can't say in any given case what what

2775
02:11:43,819 --> 02:11:41,070
the right answer is

2776
02:11:46,609 --> 02:11:43,829
so between map dowsing and field dowsing

2777
02:11:48,890 --> 02:11:46,619
there probably are sets of possible

2778
02:11:50,750 --> 02:11:48,900
explanations and

2779
02:11:52,220 --> 02:11:50,760
some people are exceptionally good

2780
02:11:54,939 --> 02:11:52,230
dowsers just like there's some people

2781
02:11:59,149 --> 02:11:54,949
are exceptionally good remove yours with

2782
02:12:01,459 --> 02:11:59,159
the dowsing rods usually are made of

2783
02:12:04,490 --> 02:12:01,469
metal at least the ones that I have seen

2784
02:12:05,839 --> 02:12:04,500
and if you're walking over out in the

2785
02:12:07,959 --> 02:12:05,849
field like you said you're looking for

2786
02:12:11,450 --> 02:12:07,969
water or minerals well there's very

2787
02:12:14,089 --> 02:12:11,460
possibility a very real possibility of

2788
02:12:16,580 --> 02:12:14,099
something electromagnetic going on it

2789
02:12:20,180 --> 02:12:16,590
get something happening there but if it

2790
02:12:23,600 --> 02:12:20,190
was plastic dowsing rods right I don't

2791
02:12:25,580 --> 02:12:23,610
know if people but then I'm going

2792
02:12:28,250 --> 02:12:25,590
somewhere with this I think it's a it's

2793
02:12:29,959 --> 02:12:28,260
a fascinating thing but I've also kind

2794
02:12:32,359 --> 02:12:29,969
of noticed people moving their wrists a

2795
02:12:34,370 --> 02:12:32,369
little bit right sure

2796
02:12:37,930 --> 02:12:34,380
but they remember that the traditional

2797
02:12:40,550 --> 02:12:37,940
dowsing rod is made out of a willow tree

2798
02:12:41,540 --> 02:12:40,560
it's made out of wood made out of wood

2799
02:12:44,660 --> 02:12:41,550
yeah

2800
02:12:46,879 --> 02:12:44,670
so it still could be sensitive to

2801
02:12:48,560 --> 02:12:46,889
electromagnetic changes but I don't

2802
02:12:51,140 --> 02:12:48,570
think that the rod itself has anything

2803
02:12:53,060 --> 02:12:51,150
to do with it it's really about a human

2804
02:12:55,370 --> 02:12:53,070
sensitivity to something which then is

2805
02:12:58,250 --> 02:12:55,380
translated probably unconsciously

2806
02:13:01,490 --> 02:12:58,260
through my tiny little motor movements

2807
02:13:04,399 --> 02:13:01,500
that the person is making now you just

2808
02:13:07,129 --> 02:13:04,409
sparked up quantum mechanics and I do

2809
02:13:11,240 --> 02:13:07,139
want to talk about magic and and and

2810
02:13:14,629 --> 02:13:11,250
science because you know 20 years ago 30

2811
02:13:19,240 --> 02:13:14,639
years ago quantum computers qubits

2812
02:13:22,609 --> 02:13:19,250
parallel worlds things affecting

2813
02:13:25,370 --> 02:13:22,619
something that you can't even see but

2814
02:13:29,990 --> 02:13:25,380
yet we are now building chips and using

2815
02:13:32,720 --> 02:13:30,000
it for hardware for computing that is

2816
02:13:34,970 --> 02:13:32,730
magic 20 years ago 30 years ago

2817
02:13:37,580 --> 02:13:34,980
forget about science fiction you could

2818
02:13:40,700 --> 02:13:37,590
definitely define that they they

2819
02:13:43,129 --> 02:13:40,710
wouldn't even accept that idea but here

2820
02:13:46,640 --> 02:13:43,139
it is today quantum computers quantum

2821
02:13:49,580 --> 02:13:46,650
mechanics quantum theory is is is as

2822
02:13:51,820 --> 02:13:49,590
real as anything and I would say that

2823
02:13:54,709 --> 02:13:51,830
that would have been a magic

2824
02:13:58,129 --> 02:13:54,719
classification and any time in the past

2825
02:13:59,870 --> 02:13:58,139
but where else would magic apply into

2826
02:14:02,900 --> 02:13:59,880
science today how would it help each

2827
02:14:05,870 --> 02:14:02,910
other so one of the

2828
02:14:07,460 --> 02:14:05,880
and in my book real magic where I get

2829
02:14:10,670 --> 02:14:07,470
into quantum mechanics and actually

2830
02:14:12,410 --> 02:14:10,680
beyond a little bit is that at the

2831
02:14:15,020 --> 02:14:12,420
moment you get to the idea where you can

2832
02:14:17,120 --> 02:14:15,030
accept that the data says that psychic

2833
02:14:20,090 --> 02:14:17,130
phenomena are basically like magical

2834
02:14:22,040 --> 02:14:20,100
practice they are real well then how

2835
02:14:23,990 --> 02:14:22,050
does it work and and that's been a

2836
02:14:26,510 --> 02:14:24,000
sticking point for a long time we don't

2837
02:14:30,410 --> 02:14:26,520
know exactly how it works but what I'm

2838
02:14:32,660 --> 02:14:30,420
proposing then in in this book is that

2839
02:14:34,130 --> 02:14:32,670
if it is true that the esoteric

2840
02:14:36,200 --> 02:14:34,140
traditions are right and somehow

2841
02:14:38,810 --> 02:14:36,210
consciousness is way more fundamental

2842
02:14:40,990 --> 02:14:38,820
than we currently think it is maybe even

2843
02:14:43,610 --> 02:14:41,000
more fundamental in the physical world

2844
02:14:45,770 --> 02:14:43,620
then you start to see a relationship

2845
02:14:48,140 --> 02:14:45,780
between what quantum mechanics is

2846
02:14:52,700 --> 02:14:48,150
telling us about reality and what magic

2847
02:14:54,590 --> 02:14:52,710
tells us so the only reason why psychic

2848
02:14:58,190 --> 02:14:54,600
phenomena in particular are considered

2849
02:15:01,250 --> 02:14:58,200
strange is because they they seem to

2850
02:15:02,600 --> 02:15:01,260
transcend space and time right you're

2851
02:15:04,400 --> 02:15:02,610
you're mentally communicate with

2852
02:15:06,080 --> 02:15:04,410
somebody at a distance well how did it

2853
02:15:08,240 --> 02:15:06,090
get there we know it's not

2854
02:15:10,100 --> 02:15:08,250
electromagnetic because lots of tests

2855
02:15:12,680 --> 02:15:10,110
have been done that exclude

2856
02:15:14,270 --> 02:15:12,690
electromagnetism as the carrier of how

2857
02:15:16,520 --> 02:15:14,280
you get information from one person to

2858
02:15:18,590 --> 02:15:16,530
the next and then when you go to remote

2859
02:15:20,990 --> 02:15:18,600
viewing it's even worse because how can

2860
02:15:23,090 --> 02:15:21,000
you describe a scene which is a couple

2861
02:15:24,530 --> 02:15:23,100
of kilometers away or on the other side

2862
02:15:26,480 --> 02:15:24,540
of the planet on the other side of the

2863
02:15:29,360 --> 02:15:26,490
planet right yeah or worse on the other

2864
02:15:31,940 --> 02:15:29,370
side of the planet next Tuesday with

2865
02:15:34,040 --> 02:15:31,950
precognition or a retro cognition right

2866
02:15:36,590 --> 02:15:34,050
it's very difficult to figure out how

2867
02:15:38,330 --> 02:15:36,600
that can be but the reason why it seems

2868
02:15:41,060 --> 02:15:38,340
strange is because the phenomena

2869
02:15:44,570 --> 02:15:41,070
transcend the ordinary boundaries of

2870
02:15:46,250 --> 02:15:44,580
space and time but exactly the same

2871
02:15:48,440 --> 02:15:46,260
thing can be said of quantum mechanics

2872
02:15:51,920 --> 02:15:48,450
that's when quantum mechanics are called

2873
02:15:55,280 --> 02:15:51,930
weird the weirdness is that the effects

2874
02:15:57,980 --> 02:15:55,290
like quantum entanglement do not appear

2875
02:16:01,550 --> 02:15:57,990
to take place in space-time their taking

2876
02:16:04,310 --> 02:16:01,560
place outside of space-time so this

2877
02:16:05,990 --> 02:16:04,320
opens the possibility that what we see

2878
02:16:08,750 --> 02:16:06,000
in quantum mechanics is something that

2879
02:16:13,460 --> 02:16:08,760
is transcending the ordinary world of

2880
02:16:16,129 --> 02:16:13,470
space and time that that phenomenon that

2881
02:16:19,219 --> 02:16:16,139
strangeness is the same strangeness

2882
02:16:20,779 --> 02:16:19,229
as we see in psychic phenomena so some

2883
02:16:23,149 --> 02:16:20,789
physicists would say well that's that's

2884
02:16:24,560 --> 02:16:23,159
nonsense you're trying to compare two

2885
02:16:27,589 --> 02:16:24,570
things which are not associated with

2886
02:16:28,399 --> 02:16:27,599
each other at all other physicists are

2887
02:16:31,189 --> 02:16:28,409
not so sure

2888
02:16:34,219 --> 02:16:31,199
in fact there's this book that was

2889
02:16:37,370 --> 02:16:34,229
written by two physicists professors

2890
02:16:40,669 --> 02:16:37,380
called quantum enigma which is a very

2891
02:16:42,799 --> 02:16:40,679
good way of seeing from a physicists

2892
02:16:44,570 --> 02:16:42,809
perspective the why consciousness is

2893
02:16:48,439 --> 02:16:44,580
considered to be so strange and what it

2894
02:16:49,879 --> 02:16:48,449
has to do with with physics I asked them

2895
02:16:51,559 --> 02:16:49,889
when did well they're writing the book

2896
02:16:54,439 --> 02:16:51,569
what did they think about parapsychology

2897
02:16:56,540 --> 02:16:54,449
and before they started they said no I

2898
02:16:59,629 --> 02:16:56,550
don't think we buy these phenomena at

2899
02:17:01,700 --> 02:16:59,639
all it's just too bizarre after they

2900
02:17:03,019 --> 02:17:01,710
finished the book and I asked him the

2901
02:17:05,479 --> 02:17:03,029
same question well now what do you think

2902
02:17:07,610 --> 02:17:05,489
about it they said well now it looks a

2903
02:17:09,889 --> 02:17:07,620
lot more plausible they're writing a

2904
02:17:12,740 --> 02:17:09,899
book called quantum enigma that's

2905
02:17:15,019 --> 02:17:12,750
exactly what they're writing about well

2906
02:17:18,169 --> 02:17:15,029
what is it that that they proved to

2907
02:17:21,669 --> 02:17:18,179
themselves where they had that moment

2908
02:17:23,929 --> 02:17:21,679
that aha moment it was finding that

2909
02:17:26,209 --> 02:17:23,939
there's something peculiar about

2910
02:17:29,089 --> 02:17:26,219
consciousness which is deeply related to

2911
02:17:30,439 --> 02:17:29,099
quantum mechanics and of course they're

2912
02:17:32,599 --> 02:17:30,449
not the only ones who have seen this

2913
02:17:34,820 --> 02:17:32,609
connection the most of the founders of

2914
02:17:37,089 --> 02:17:34,830
quantum mechanics were saying right off

2915
02:17:39,969 --> 02:17:37,099
right from the very beginning that

2916
02:17:42,740 --> 02:17:39,979
something about consciousness awareness

2917
02:17:46,639 --> 02:17:42,750
seems to be involved in the behavior of

2918
02:17:48,830 --> 02:17:46,649
quantum systems so that that's where the

2919
02:17:50,479 --> 02:17:48,840
connection is we we some people will

2920
02:17:52,519 --> 02:17:50,489
immediately jump and say well quantum

2921
02:17:54,769 --> 02:17:52,529
mechanics explains psychic phenomena and

2922
02:17:58,490 --> 02:17:54,779
it doesn't do that all it does is say

2923
02:18:01,009 --> 02:17:58,500
that the reality that is suggested by

2924
02:18:02,599 --> 02:18:01,019
quantum mechanics the strange place

2925
02:18:05,450 --> 02:18:02,609
where space and time or somehow

2926
02:18:07,639 --> 02:18:05,460
transcended that that reality is very

2927
02:18:10,160 --> 02:18:07,649
compatible with the experiences that

2928
02:18:12,139 --> 02:18:10,170
people talk about it doesn't mean it's

2929
02:18:15,679 --> 02:18:12,149
it's an explanation yet but it's showing

2930
02:18:18,320 --> 02:18:15,689
at least that what used to be said that

2931
02:18:21,259 --> 02:18:18,330
psychic phenomena violate what we know

2932
02:18:22,759 --> 02:18:21,269
about physics that is no longer true it

2933
02:18:23,740 --> 02:18:22,769
does not violate what we know about

2934
02:18:26,129 --> 02:18:23,750
physics

2935
02:18:33,310 --> 02:18:26,139
the

2936
02:18:38,589 --> 02:18:33,320
from Scott I was gonna go here anyway

2937
02:18:40,480 --> 02:18:38,599
then is magic real right is magic real

2938
02:18:44,140 --> 02:18:40,490
or is there something else here that

2939
02:18:46,919 --> 02:18:44,150
we're not comprehending in reality well

2940
02:18:49,990 --> 02:18:46,929
I would put it as divination real yes is

2941
02:18:54,339 --> 02:18:50,000
power of will or manifestation real yes

2942
02:18:57,430 --> 02:18:54,349
is theour ji real yes and all of that is

2943
02:18:59,490 --> 02:18:57,440
based not on the esoteric lore but on

2944
02:19:02,110 --> 02:18:59,500
controlled experiments in the laboratory

2945
02:19:04,450 --> 02:19:02,120
so as I mentioned in this this article

2946
02:19:05,919 --> 02:19:04,460
in American psychologist is looking at

2947
02:19:08,830 --> 02:19:05,929
the ten classes of repeatable

2948
02:19:10,839 --> 02:19:08,840
experiments that are positive and those

2949
02:19:13,509 --> 02:19:10,849
are all talking about these kinds of

2950
02:19:16,660 --> 02:19:13,519
magical practices so yeah magic is real

2951
02:19:18,190 --> 02:19:16,670
by saying that what what will happen in

2952
02:19:20,140 --> 02:19:18,200
many people's minds is they will

2953
02:19:23,440 --> 02:19:20,150
conflate it suddenly into Harry Potter

2954
02:19:25,810 --> 02:19:23,450
is real and no Harry Potter is not real

2955
02:19:27,459 --> 02:19:25,820
and what you see in movies is not real

2956
02:19:31,140 --> 02:19:27,469
those are of course fictional

2957
02:19:35,860 --> 02:19:31,150
elaborations of what's of the real stuff

2958
02:19:37,209 --> 02:19:35,870
but the the basic phenomena are real the

2959
02:19:40,750 --> 02:19:37,219
other thing I want to add to that though

2960
02:19:42,459 --> 02:19:40,760
is that this even some of my colleagues

2961
02:19:45,250 --> 02:19:42,469
in parapsychology were kind of surprised

2962
02:19:47,620 --> 02:19:45,260
that I wrote a book about magic because

2963
02:19:49,690 --> 02:19:47,630
it doesn't seem it seems like it's

2964
02:19:52,720 --> 02:19:49,700
unseemly for a scientist to talk about

2965
02:19:54,850 --> 02:19:52,730
magic is it though it's real but when I

2966
02:19:57,220 --> 02:19:54,860
finished the book I realized that this

2967
02:20:00,520 --> 02:19:57,230
actually is a book about science and

2968
02:20:02,860 --> 02:20:00,530
philosophy and evidence and so on so

2969
02:20:04,780 --> 02:20:02,870
rather than asking when I psychic

2970
02:20:07,810 --> 02:20:04,790
friends to see if they would endorse the

2971
02:20:10,540 --> 02:20:07,820
book I only went to scientists and so

2972
02:20:12,880 --> 02:20:10,550
this book real magic has been endorsed

2973
02:20:15,940 --> 02:20:12,890
by two Nobel laureates by one in

2974
02:20:17,620 --> 02:20:15,950
chemistry and one in physics by a former

2975
02:20:21,100 --> 02:20:17,630
program director at the National Science

2976
02:20:23,620 --> 02:20:21,110
Foundation by the president of the

2977
02:20:25,570 --> 02:20:23,630
American Statistical Association by

2978
02:20:26,710 --> 02:20:25,580
major prize winners from the National

2979
02:20:29,110 --> 02:20:26,720
Institutes of Health and the National

2980
02:20:31,810 --> 02:20:29,120
Academy of Sciences and many other

2981
02:20:35,650 --> 02:20:31,820
mainstream university professors and

2982
02:20:38,170 --> 02:20:35,660
science and scholarship so you sometimes

2983
02:20:39,850 --> 02:20:38,180
think that well no mainstream scientists

2984
02:20:43,810 --> 02:20:39,860
would ever want to endorse

2985
02:20:46,211 --> 02:20:43,820
book about magic but actually they do so

2986
02:20:48,640 --> 02:20:46,221
the other piece of this is a couple of

2987
02:20:51,730 --> 02:20:48,650
months ago I was in in Germany giving a

2988
02:20:53,381 --> 02:20:51,740
talk for the company Merck which is best

2989
02:20:56,051 --> 02:20:53,391
known for pharmaceuticals but they also

2990
02:20:58,450 --> 02:20:56,061
make materials and a few other things so

2991
02:21:02,171 --> 02:20:58,460
this is a big international science

2992
02:21:04,421 --> 02:21:02,181
conference with 35 speakers five of them

2993
02:21:08,081 --> 02:21:04,431
were Nobel laureates and also craig

2994
02:21:11,501 --> 02:21:08,091
Venter who's the the first person to the

2995
02:21:14,051 --> 02:21:11,511
sequence the human genome a special

2996
02:21:16,810 --> 02:21:14,061
address by the CEO of Microsoft lots of

2997
02:21:19,660 --> 02:21:16,820
very prominent people and I also was

2998
02:21:24,700 --> 02:21:19,670
invited to be one of the speakers so in

2999
02:21:29,950 --> 02:21:24,710
some some slice of mainstream science

3000
02:21:32,680 --> 02:21:29,960
now there is a significant opening to do

3001
02:21:35,110 --> 02:21:32,690
magic I was talking about magic at this

3002
02:21:39,910 --> 02:21:35,120
science conference and the reason is

3003
02:21:42,120 --> 02:21:39,920
that that the evidence now the nature of

3004
02:21:45,190 --> 02:21:42,130
the scientific evidence is so strong

3005
02:21:47,860 --> 02:21:45,200
that unless somebody simply doesn't want

3006
02:21:49,720 --> 02:21:47,870
to believe it which people can believe

3007
02:21:51,220 --> 02:21:49,730
whatever they want right but if your

3008
02:21:54,041 --> 02:21:51,230
scientist and you look at the data and

3009
02:21:55,990 --> 02:21:54,051
you look at the results that we get it's

3010
02:21:58,511 --> 02:21:56,000
very difficult at this point to deny

3011
02:22:00,400 --> 02:21:58,521
that these phenomena exist and so the

3012
02:22:03,220 --> 02:22:00,410
connection then back to magic is exactly

3013
02:22:04,961 --> 02:22:03,230
as they said the practice and magic is

3014
02:22:07,030 --> 02:22:04,971
called divination practice in the

3015
02:22:09,430 --> 02:22:07,040
laboratory is called precognition it's

3016
02:22:12,341 --> 02:22:09,440
the same thing you know I was talking

3017
02:22:16,870 --> 02:22:12,351
with Julia about this last night Moss

3018
02:22:19,961 --> 02:22:16,880
bridge in that today science is as far

3019
02:22:21,400 --> 02:22:19,971
as they have come is finding out more

3020
02:22:24,070 --> 02:22:21,410
and more that they don't understand

3021
02:22:26,291 --> 02:22:24,080
anything right that's really the truth

3022
02:22:29,261 --> 02:22:26,301
and it's the bottom line I wanted to ask

3023
02:22:33,370 --> 02:22:29,271
you this before we have to part ways and

3024
02:22:36,581 --> 02:22:33,380
say goodnight if you were in court right

3025
02:22:40,690 --> 02:22:36,591
you're in magic court and you've got

3026
02:22:44,770 --> 02:22:40,700
James Randi as the judge right he got by

3027
02:22:49,511 --> 02:22:44,780
the bench and you've got to present the

3028
02:22:53,041 --> 02:22:49,521
one piece of evidence to show that that

3029
02:22:55,921 --> 02:22:53,051
magic and science are not only

3030
02:22:58,801 --> 02:22:55,931
in the same but this is proving that

3031
02:23:01,020 --> 02:22:58,811
magic is real and you need to shut Randy

3032
02:23:03,201 --> 02:23:01,030
up what are you going to slide across

3033
02:23:06,650 --> 02:23:03,211
the evidence table what's that one thing

3034
02:23:09,930 --> 02:23:06,660
well first I would take about a semester

3035
02:23:12,291 --> 02:23:09,940
to Train Randy how to understand

3036
02:23:14,671 --> 02:23:12,301
statistics and experimental design

3037
02:23:17,251 --> 02:23:14,681
because if the only thing that Randy

3038
02:23:18,301 --> 02:23:17,261
would accept was somebody levitating in

3039
02:23:20,251 --> 02:23:18,311
front of him

3040
02:23:24,091 --> 02:23:20,261
right we're not there we can't do that

3041
02:23:26,671 --> 02:23:24,101
so you you have to understand how to

3042
02:23:28,110 --> 02:23:26,681
evaluate evidence if we're going to

3043
02:23:30,150 --> 02:23:28,120
demonstrate an experiment I would

3044
02:23:32,581 --> 02:23:30,160
probably do one on presentiments which

3045
02:23:35,100 --> 02:23:32,591
you may have talked about with Julia so

3046
02:23:38,070 --> 02:23:35,110
this is an unconscious physiological

3047
02:23:40,411 --> 02:23:38,080
form of precognition there's now been

3048
02:23:42,631 --> 02:23:40,421
something like four dozen repeated

3049
02:23:45,060 --> 02:23:42,641
experiments and it's a very real effect

3050
02:23:48,390 --> 02:23:45,070
it's not difficult to do and what it

3051
02:23:50,701 --> 02:23:48,400
shows is that the you unconsciously as

3052
02:23:53,070 --> 02:23:50,711
reflected by how your body is changing

3053
02:23:54,631 --> 02:23:53,080
your nervous system we unconsciously can

3054
02:23:56,970 --> 02:23:54,641
anticipate somewhere between three and

3055
02:23:59,430 --> 02:23:56,980
ten seconds before something happens and

3056
02:24:01,411 --> 02:23:59,440
again you can see that by measuring

3057
02:24:03,060 --> 02:24:01,421
things like heart rate and pupil

3058
02:24:06,810 --> 02:24:03,070
dilation and other physiological

3059
02:24:09,150 --> 02:24:06,820
measures right so that's a fairly easy

3060
02:24:12,211 --> 02:24:09,160
an experiment to to run the results are

3061
02:24:15,121 --> 02:24:12,221
fairly robust it would still take

3062
02:24:16,801 --> 02:24:15,131
multiple trials by multiple people to

3063
02:24:18,421 --> 02:24:16,811
reach a stage where you're able to say

3064
02:24:21,421 --> 02:24:18,431
well here this is the resulting

3065
02:24:23,730 --> 02:24:21,431
experiment and it worked so something

3066
02:24:25,671 --> 02:24:23,740
like that but again if if you're dealing

3067
02:24:28,890 --> 02:24:25,681
with somebody who will only accept

3068
02:24:34,081 --> 02:24:28,900
levitation in front of them but we can't

3069
02:24:38,211 --> 02:24:34,091
do that not on demand what can you leave

3070
02:24:41,911 --> 02:24:38,221
our audience with something very simple

3071
02:24:45,301 --> 02:24:41,921
that they could practice and start to

3072
02:24:47,581 --> 02:24:45,311
understand magic so one chapter in the

3073
02:24:50,961 --> 02:24:47,591
book is about magical practice and I

3074
02:24:53,791 --> 02:24:50,971
talked about two of the most elementary

3075
02:24:56,610 --> 02:24:53,801
forms of practice one of one of which is

3076
02:24:59,970 --> 02:24:56,620
called writing magic where you simply

3077
02:25:01,501 --> 02:24:59,980
write down what you want and I give

3078
02:25:04,171 --> 02:25:01,511
instructions and how to do that

3079
02:25:06,211 --> 02:25:04,181
and the other one is called sigil magic

3080
02:25:06,600 --> 02:25:06,221
which is very similar except that rather

3081
02:25:08,520 --> 02:25:06,610
than

3082
02:25:12,120 --> 02:25:08,530
writing it you make a little symbol

3083
02:25:13,980 --> 02:25:12,130
cynicism in symbol you make a symbol for

3084
02:25:16,820 --> 02:25:13,990
the thing that you want and then there's

3085
02:25:20,671 --> 02:25:16,830
a way of so-called charging it and and

3086
02:25:22,650 --> 02:25:20,681
intentionally focusing on it and I'd

3087
02:25:24,541 --> 02:25:22,660
since I put it in the book and I one of

3088
02:25:26,640 --> 02:25:24,551
the examples for sigil was that you

3089
02:25:29,190 --> 02:25:26,650
would you make a sigil to find ten

3090
02:25:32,160 --> 02:25:29,200
dollars and then I would want people to

3091
02:25:34,350 --> 02:25:32,170
tell me afterwards at work well one

3092
02:25:35,730 --> 02:25:34,360
person found a dollar and the next

3093
02:25:37,230 --> 02:25:35,740
person who mentioned something found

3094
02:25:39,930 --> 02:25:37,240
something like seventeen thousand

3095
02:25:42,390 --> 02:25:39,940
dollars and it wasn't that she found a

3096
02:25:45,600 --> 02:25:42,400
pile of cash on the floor but she found

3097
02:25:48,180 --> 02:25:45,610
that she was do this big pile of money

3098
02:25:49,860 --> 02:25:48,190
that she was unaware of before but she

3099
02:25:53,280 --> 02:25:49,870
went through the magical process and

3100
02:25:56,220 --> 02:25:53,290
then came upon this big bunch of money

3101
02:25:58,381 --> 02:25:56,230
that she was due to get and so she

3102
02:26:01,860 --> 02:25:58,391
attributed it to doing the the exercise

3103
02:26:04,110 --> 02:26:01,870
you know now I I almost feel like James

3104
02:26:06,660 --> 02:26:04,120
Randi right now where I'm gonna go come

3105
02:26:09,841 --> 02:26:06,670
on but see the thing is is you're a

3106
02:26:13,410 --> 02:26:09,851
scientist Dean and now you're suggesting

3107
02:26:16,770 --> 02:26:13,420
something like this that's pretty

3108
02:26:19,711 --> 02:26:16,780
powerful stuff for for the audience's

3109
02:26:23,160 --> 02:26:19,721
open-minded but you're also a scientist

3110
02:26:25,440 --> 02:26:23,170
suggesting sigil magic right well pseudo

3111
02:26:28,350 --> 02:26:25,450
magic it were writing magic are just

3112
02:26:29,850 --> 02:26:28,360
ways of focusing intention we have lots

3113
02:26:33,930 --> 02:26:29,860
and lots of experiments that are all

3114
02:26:36,541 --> 02:26:33,940
about intention so the while sigil magic

3115
02:26:38,820 --> 02:26:36,551
is comes out of ancient times people are

3116
02:26:41,150 --> 02:26:38,830
doing these kinds of tasks all it really

3117
02:26:44,070 --> 02:26:41,160
is is a way to focus one's attention

3118
02:26:46,921 --> 02:26:44,080
that that's what it is so we know that

3119
02:26:49,680 --> 02:26:46,931
that works in a more abstract way in the

3120
02:26:51,841 --> 02:26:49,690
laboratory in the case of a lady finding

3121
02:26:53,970 --> 02:26:51,851
a huge amount of money it could be a

3122
02:26:56,940 --> 02:26:53,980
coincidence that's why we don't we can't

3123
02:26:59,041 --> 02:26:56,950
place a lot of confidence on anecdotes

3124
02:27:01,591 --> 02:26:59,051
but you could read about her experience

3125
02:27:03,570 --> 02:27:01,601
by by going to Amazon and looking at the

3126
02:27:05,910 --> 02:27:03,580
the reviews because she actually wrote

3127
02:27:07,560 --> 02:27:05,920
it in their review of the book and I

3128
02:27:09,631 --> 02:27:07,570
don't I don't know this lady and I

3129
02:27:11,610 --> 02:27:09,641
didn't ask her to write that that's just

3130
02:27:14,131 --> 02:27:11,620
what her experience was what a great

3131
02:27:16,520 --> 02:27:14,141
conversation tonight Dean thank you so

3132
02:27:19,280 --> 02:27:16,530
much for taking the time and

3133
02:27:21,650 --> 02:27:19,290
I gotta get up to noetic I've got to

3134
02:27:24,470 --> 02:27:21,660
come up there I've seen the pictures and

3135
02:27:26,240 --> 02:27:24,480
videos for so many years and it just

3136
02:27:28,190 --> 02:27:26,250
looks like the ultimate wonderful place

3137
02:27:30,530 --> 02:27:28,200
to go and hang out well you're welcome

3138
02:27:32,770 --> 02:27:30,540
anytime thank you so much Dean working

3139
02:27:36,051 --> 02:27:32,780
everybody go and get the book right now

3140
02:27:39,140 --> 02:27:36,061
any place online that sells books and

3141
02:27:42,230 --> 02:27:39,150
any store that sells books is that is it

3142
02:27:45,051 --> 02:27:42,240
at noetic dot org dono go go to

3143
02:27:46,910 --> 02:27:45,061
amazon.com or Barnes & Noble

3144
02:27:51,711 --> 02:27:46,920
it turns out that the audiobook version

3145
02:27:54,381 --> 02:27:51,721
is selling the best and the audiobook

3146
02:27:57,410 --> 02:27:54,391
version was read by the voice artist who

3147
02:27:59,870 --> 02:27:57,420
does the Dan Brown books so it was very

3148
02:28:01,761 --> 02:27:59,880
happy to be able to select him to be the

3149
02:28:03,290 --> 02:28:01,771
reader and it makes a big difference

3150
02:28:06,350 --> 02:28:03,300
because you don't want me to read a book

3151
02:28:08,570 --> 02:28:06,360
for eight hours or me thank you so much

3152
02:28:11,270 --> 02:28:08,580
Dean enjoy the rest of your evening

3153
02:28:14,900 --> 02:28:11,280
thank you so much you're welcome Dean

3154
02:28:17,660 --> 02:28:14,910
Radin okay very simple Dean Radin org

3155
02:28:20,540 --> 02:28:17,670
noetic org and of course you can find

3156
02:28:23,030 --> 02:28:20,550
real magic over at Amazon and we have

3157
02:28:24,860 --> 02:28:23,040
the links up at Jimmy Church radio calm

3158
02:28:27,080 --> 02:28:24,870
all right I'm gonna take a quick break

3159
02:28:28,820 --> 02:28:27,090
right here and I'm gonna open up the

3160
02:28:30,830 --> 02:28:28,830
phone line so let's go we'll do a little

3161
02:28:32,690 --> 02:28:30,840
bit of fate or night a little taste of

3162
02:28:34,850 --> 02:28:32,700
fate or night and I'll open up the phone

3163
02:28:36,400 --> 02:28:34,860
lines and take your phone calls max I'll

3164
02:28:57,420 --> 02:28:36,410
be right back stay with me

3165
02:29:00,609 --> 02:28:57,430
[Music]

3166
02:29:04,830 --> 02:29:00,619
and you are listening to my boy Jimmy

3167
02:29:18,700 --> 02:29:08,739
this my popular opinion reading a book

3168
02:29:22,420 --> 02:29:18,710
will not make you smarter hurricanes

3169
02:29:24,160 --> 02:29:22,430
earthquakes wildfires this year we've

3170
02:29:26,979 --> 02:29:24,170
experienced more than our fair share

3171
02:29:29,439 --> 02:29:26,989
this is Jimmy Church a fade to black and

3172
02:29:31,689 --> 02:29:29,449
last month I decided to make sure my

3173
02:29:33,489 --> 02:29:31,699
family does not have to worry about food

3174
02:29:37,000 --> 02:29:33,499
that should we get caught in a real

3175
02:29:39,160 --> 02:29:37,010
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3176
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3177
02:29:42,819 --> 02:29:40,819
good that you'll want to eat it every

3178
02:29:45,309 --> 02:29:42,829
day instead of just during those times

3179
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of duress all new manna products have a

3180
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3181
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3182
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with the new manna pack in your home

3183
02:29:58,359 --> 02:29:55,550
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3184
02:30:01,239 --> 02:29:58,369
that you protected your family not only

3185
02:30:03,670 --> 02:30:01,249
have I tasted and tested I own it

3186
02:30:05,380 --> 02:30:03,680
now you can too just click on the new

3187
02:30:07,719 --> 02:30:05,390
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3188
02:30:10,179 --> 02:30:07,729
and use the promo code Jimmy when you

3189
02:30:11,830 --> 02:30:10,189
order in addition to a discount we'll

3190
02:30:12,790 --> 02:30:11,840
send you an autograph fade to black

3191
02:30:16,809 --> 02:30:12,800
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3192
02:30:18,849 --> 02:30:16,819
seriously gobekli tepe this is Jimmy

3193
02:30:21,910 --> 02:30:18,859
Church of fade to black and I take life

3194
02:30:25,120 --> 02:30:21,920
change tea supplements every single day

3195
02:30:28,679 --> 02:30:25,130
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3199
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3204
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02:30:58,410 --> 02:30:55,870
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3215
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15% off of your order today Gobekli Tepe

3216
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hi folks CBD is the home run hitter for

3217
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health right now why do you ask because

3218
02:31:35,430 --> 02:31:32,710
of what it does for the body

3219
02:31:37,620 --> 02:31:35,440
unfortunately I can't tell you all about

3220
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the benefit you know there's reasons do

3221
02:31:40,920 --> 02:31:39,700
your due diligence and log on to ancient

3222
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3223
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3224
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3225
02:31:53,130 --> 02:31:49,960
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3226
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none psychoactive logon to ancient life

3227
02:31:58,980 --> 02:31:54,220
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3228
02:32:01,790 --> 02:31:58,990
Jimmy Church of fade to black and my

3229
02:32:05,160 --> 02:32:01,800
family is safe because of new mana

3230
02:32:06,990 --> 02:32:05,170
emergency food storage just go to the

3231
02:32:12,900 --> 02:32:07,000
new mana banner at Jimmy Church

3232
02:32:15,630 --> 02:32:12,910
radio.com promo code jimmy 10 are you

3233
02:32:18,150 --> 02:32:15,640
intrigued by paranormal talk radio you

3234
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3235
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3238
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3239
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3240
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3241
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the network you're listening to right

3242
02:32:48,230 --> 02:32:37,960
now the paranormal radio app free in

3243
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it's not a lifestyle we chose we were

3244
02:33:00,599 --> 02:32:53,290
born this way

3245
02:33:00,609 --> 02:33:07,520
this is KJ CR Jimmy's church Radio gaga

3246
02:33:07,530 --> 02:33:18,940
[Music]

3247
02:33:25,240 --> 02:33:21,370
all right welcome back fade to black our

3248
02:33:28,091 --> 02:33:25,250
last show this week I want to thank Dean

3249
02:33:32,500 --> 02:33:28,101
Radin PhD the Institute of noetic

3250
02:33:34,810 --> 02:33:32,510
Sciences the chief scientist amazing

3251
02:33:39,160 --> 02:33:34,820
amazing conversation tonight and you can

3252
02:33:42,640 --> 02:33:39,170
follow Dean at Dean Radin @ ra di an at

3253
02:33:45,131 --> 02:33:42,650
Dean Radin on Twitter and go and get the

3254
02:33:48,131 --> 02:33:45,141
book the book real magic is is it's just

3255
02:33:50,890 --> 02:33:48,141
it's an amazing read and when you're

3256
02:33:55,140 --> 02:33:50,900
dealing with everything at a scientific

3257
02:33:58,841 --> 02:33:55,150
level and and going into these fringe

3258
02:34:02,830 --> 02:33:58,851
topics that are fringed to society but

3259
02:34:08,200 --> 02:34:02,840
not to us it's great and I I know that

3260
02:34:10,110 --> 02:34:08,210
that that line is blurring between not

3261
02:34:11,770 --> 02:34:10,120
only parapsychology and science but

3262
02:34:14,080 --> 02:34:11,780
everything when we're talking about

3263
02:34:17,410 --> 02:34:14,090
telepathy and telekinesis and ESP and

3264
02:34:19,870 --> 02:34:17,420
remote viewing all of that so thank you

3265
02:34:24,011 --> 02:34:19,880
Dean an amazing conversation now let's

3266
02:34:25,390 --> 02:34:24,021
do a little mini fader night all right

3267
02:34:27,011 --> 02:34:25,400
I'm gonna open up all the phone lines

3268
02:34:29,801 --> 02:34:27,021
everybody stay right there if you're on

3269
02:34:35,200 --> 02:34:29,811
hold but the numbers are 3 to 3 8 2 5 5

3270
02:34:40,060 --> 02:34:35,210
0 4 or 5 or 3 2 3 2 7 5 9 6 9 5 or 8 1 8

3271
02:34:42,520 --> 02:34:40,070
9 to 1 6 9 to 9 let's go to nap town

3272
02:34:46,570 --> 02:34:42,530
Indianapolis you're up on fader block

3273
02:34:51,160 --> 02:34:46,580
who's calling hey Jimmy it's Ellison how

3274
02:34:54,910 --> 02:34:51,170
are you whoa whoa hold on a minute

3275
02:34:56,830 --> 02:34:54,920
how are ya listen I'm excellent man I

3276
02:34:59,620 --> 02:34:56,840
haven't talked to you in like a month of

3277
02:35:02,080 --> 02:34:59,630
Sundays well that's because the last

3278
02:35:08,970 --> 02:35:02,090
time I was on the air I was a very bad

3279
02:35:15,040 --> 02:35:12,520
obviously I I've blocked the memory I

3280
02:35:17,350 --> 02:35:15,050
guess you were bad okay all right yeah I

3281
02:35:17,860 --> 02:35:17,360
was I'm glad you blocked the memory okay

3282
02:35:19,301 --> 02:35:17,870
there you go

3283
02:35:23,320 --> 02:35:19,311
what's on your mind tonight Allison

3284
02:35:24,881 --> 02:35:23,330
great conversation tonight oh oh that's

3285
02:35:28,240 --> 02:35:24,891
why I'm calling this was just

3286
02:35:30,160 --> 02:35:28,250
superlative in my opinion and of course

3287
02:35:32,930 --> 02:35:30,170
everybody who reads my blogs knows

3288
02:35:37,070 --> 02:35:32,940
that's all I'm full of is my own opinion

3289
02:35:40,370 --> 02:35:37,080
sure this this issue is the absolute

3290
02:35:48,640 --> 02:35:40,380
crux of everything that we are looking

3291
02:35:53,900 --> 02:35:53,540
skinwalker you name it well how so how

3292
02:36:06,740 --> 02:35:53,910
so

3293
02:36:11,030 --> 02:36:06,750
is because all of these issues seem to

3294
02:36:14,740 --> 02:36:11,040
be dependent upon how we interact with

3295
02:36:22,670 --> 02:36:14,750
them the quantum effect in other words

3296
02:36:25,700 --> 02:36:22,680
how we are able to you know what your

3297
02:36:28,070 --> 02:36:25,710
intent is is what your experience will

3298
02:36:32,810 --> 02:36:28,080
be and a lot of people don't understand

3299
02:36:36,051 --> 02:36:32,820
that and there was a great blog post on

3300
02:36:38,511 --> 02:36:36,061
YouTube today that I actually blogged

3301
02:36:42,830 --> 02:36:38,521
about that that took this into account

3302
02:36:45,381 --> 02:36:42,840
but when you take a look at what Dean is

3303
02:36:47,150 --> 02:36:45,391
saying and what he's studying and how

3304
02:36:49,940 --> 02:36:47,160
he's putting it all out there he is

3305
02:36:52,400 --> 02:36:49,950
taking this intersect between quantum

3306
02:36:56,240 --> 02:36:52,410
mechanics and consciousness and showing

3307
02:36:58,970 --> 02:36:56,250
you how what the intersect is we need to

3308
02:37:02,060 --> 02:36:58,980
we've been separated for so many years

3309
02:37:05,240 --> 02:37:02,070
between science and what people would

3310
02:37:07,700 --> 02:37:05,250
call spiritual issues and really they're

3311
02:37:10,490 --> 02:37:07,710
one in the same and that's all I do on

3312
02:37:14,180 --> 02:37:10,500
my blog is yell about this

3313
02:37:17,390 --> 02:37:14,190
I get boring after a while but hey you

3314
02:37:19,220 --> 02:37:17,400
know it's very very important and what

3315
02:37:21,950 --> 02:37:19,230
he symbolizes what he's doing the work

3316
02:37:24,740 --> 02:37:21,960
that he's doing is enabling the

3317
02:37:27,700 --> 02:37:24,750
scientific community to find some sort

3318
02:37:32,210 --> 02:37:27,710
of unity with the rest of us he's making

3319
02:37:35,270 --> 02:37:32,220
spiritual issues materialistic science

3320
02:37:40,100 --> 02:37:35,280
in a way that says we can measure this

3321
02:37:44,631 --> 02:37:40,110
we can show you how this works and if

3322
02:37:46,130 --> 02:37:44,641
you follow grant Cameron he and I agree

3323
02:37:48,110 --> 02:37:46,140
with him totally current

3324
02:37:49,429 --> 02:37:48,120
this is the issue consciousness is

3325
02:37:51,830 --> 02:37:49,439
everything and I've been writing

3326
02:37:54,260 --> 02:37:51,840
consciousness as the unified field for

3327
02:37:55,340 --> 02:37:54,270
what the last four years five years I

3328
02:37:58,969 --> 02:37:55,350
don't know however long I've been

3329
02:38:04,700 --> 02:37:58,979
writing and it's true and I just get so

3330
02:38:06,710 --> 02:38:04,710
excited when I hear people like yeah and

3331
02:38:09,679 --> 02:38:06,720
and you're right what you know last

3332
02:38:12,349 --> 02:38:09,689
night and I'm talking about time travel

3333
02:38:14,630 --> 02:38:12,359
with Julia all of the guests that we've

3334
02:38:16,219 --> 02:38:14,640
talked about time travel with you know

3335
02:38:18,769 --> 02:38:16,229
where would you go what would you do and

3336
02:38:21,740 --> 02:38:18,779
I've often had this crazy thought you

3337
02:38:23,360 --> 02:38:21,750
know you travel to the future and so

3338
02:38:25,550 --> 02:38:23,370
you're you know you're talking with

3339
02:38:30,290 --> 02:38:25,560
people you're watching TV or something

3340
02:38:34,729 --> 02:38:30,300
and and it's just like okay so so give

3341
02:38:38,330 --> 02:38:34,739
me something and you hear these magical

3342
02:38:41,620 --> 02:38:38,340
words you know well okay here in the

3343
02:38:44,090 --> 02:38:41,630
future we figured out consciousness

3344
02:38:46,519 --> 02:38:44,100
right that's that's the Holy Grail

3345
02:38:50,450 --> 02:38:46,529
that's what you'd want to hear not that

3346
02:38:53,809 --> 02:38:50,460
we've figured out parallel worlds or we

3347
02:38:55,370 --> 02:38:53,819
figured out folding space and time well

3348
02:38:58,160 --> 02:38:55,380
you know those things are a given we're

3349
02:39:05,030 --> 02:38:58,170
gonna get there but what about figuring

3350
02:39:07,760 --> 02:39:05,040
out consciousness something holding

3351
02:39:11,510 --> 02:39:07,770
space and time is an issue of

3352
02:39:15,860 --> 02:39:11,520
consciousness could be good be I don't

3353
02:39:18,410 --> 02:39:15,870
have a clue but you could be it it is

3354
02:39:20,510 --> 02:39:18,420
and and it's like a god I was like I

3355
02:39:23,660 --> 02:39:20,520
would get so nervous when I call into

3356
02:39:24,910 --> 02:39:23,670
the show and I have all this I can't get

3357
02:39:31,910 --> 02:39:24,920
it out of my mouth

3358
02:39:33,679 --> 02:39:31,920
if you studies what you know when I sit

3359
02:39:42,320 --> 02:39:33,689
with you in person you don't have a

3360
02:39:46,240 --> 02:39:42,330
problem talking it's really hard on the

3361
02:39:52,519 --> 02:39:46,250
radio but it okay

3362
02:39:57,740 --> 02:39:52,529
the quantum observer effect is the key

3363
02:40:00,620 --> 02:39:57,750
to time travel and it's not just

3364
02:40:01,940 --> 02:40:00,630
it's not just what you think it's the

3365
02:40:03,950 --> 02:40:01,950
emotion you put into it

3366
02:40:06,320 --> 02:40:03,960
it's the intense you put into it it's

3367
02:40:11,450 --> 02:40:06,330
the entire ball of wax

3368
02:40:16,099 --> 02:40:11,460
it is the quantum of beingness which is

3369
02:40:18,320 --> 02:40:16,109
going to enable us to be able to fold

3370
02:40:21,590 --> 02:40:18,330
time and space it's like grant Cameron

3371
02:40:24,650 --> 02:40:21,600
interviews people who fly quote-unquote

3372
02:40:26,800 --> 02:40:24,660
the ship and the interface between the

3373
02:40:29,599 --> 02:40:26,810
consciousness a person and the ship

3374
02:40:34,010 --> 02:40:29,609
enables you to go wherever you want to

3375
02:40:38,840 --> 02:40:34,020
go and if and and and it is my opinion

3376
02:40:43,370 --> 02:40:38,850
that when you sit and you imagine things

3377
02:40:47,120 --> 02:40:43,380
or your daydream you're actually going

3378
02:40:49,639 --> 02:40:47,130
places and doing things when you are in

3379
02:40:53,300 --> 02:40:49,649
a dream state you're actually going

3380
02:41:01,660 --> 02:40:53,310
places and doing things it we are so

3381
02:41:08,870 --> 02:41:05,389
materialistic science which has its

3382
02:41:13,000 --> 02:41:08,880
place but isn't isn't the end-all be-all

3383
02:41:17,570 --> 02:41:13,010
of everything that we are unable to

3384
02:41:21,700 --> 02:41:17,580
understand the quantum part of who we

3385
02:41:24,260 --> 02:41:21,710
are we're afraid of it we are we are

3386
02:41:27,590 --> 02:41:24,270
discombobulated we we have no way of

3387
02:41:31,010 --> 02:41:27,600
navigating anything past what you can

3388
02:41:35,510 --> 02:41:31,020
see in touch and and that is only one

3389
02:41:38,179 --> 02:41:35,520
tiny tiny itty-bitty little piece of the

3390
02:41:40,719 --> 02:41:38,189
electromagnetic spectrum which were

3391
02:41:44,059 --> 02:41:40,729
swimming in at all times

3392
02:41:49,099 --> 02:41:44,069
that's why that's why you are Allison

3393
02:41:51,440 --> 02:41:49,109
Bell right there yeah and it would take

3394
02:41:53,360 --> 02:41:51,450
forever to explain it but but I Dean

3395
02:41:55,389 --> 02:41:53,370
Radin was so cool oh thank you thank you

3396
02:41:58,460 --> 02:41:55,399
thank you it was wonderful it was just

3397
02:42:01,000 --> 02:41:58,470
and you have a great rest of your

3398
02:42:04,160 --> 02:42:01,010
evening and have a fantastic weekend

3399
02:42:06,200 --> 02:42:04,170
thank you thank you and I will and this

3400
02:42:07,660 --> 02:42:06,210
was a great the whole leak was actually

3401
02:42:10,750 --> 02:42:07,670
quite actually yeah it was pretty

3402
02:42:11,200 --> 02:42:10,760
yeah yeah really was it was great thank

3403
02:42:19,750 --> 02:42:11,210
you

3404
02:42:23,260 --> 02:42:19,760
Alison bail right there let's go to area

3405
02:42:26,679 --> 02:42:23,270
code 405 you're up next on fade to black

3406
02:42:34,330 --> 02:42:31,770
McGee this is who McGee

3407
02:42:37,929 --> 02:42:34,340
[Music]

3408
02:42:41,920 --> 02:42:37,939
mr. Kelly student okay miss Kelly

3409
02:42:48,730 --> 02:42:41,930
student Matt I did you you've stumped

3410
02:42:50,400 --> 02:42:48,740
the panel dream the guy with the Moors

3411
02:42:53,350 --> 02:42:50,410
dream

3412
02:42:58,179 --> 02:42:53,360
Oh Kelly

3413
02:43:04,900 --> 02:42:58,189
a gun come on man you gotta help me a

3414
02:43:08,260 --> 02:43:04,910
little more than that good I would

3415
02:43:10,420 --> 02:43:08,270
recommend the book what uh there's a

3416
02:43:12,730 --> 02:43:10,430
book called the magically of

3417
02:43:15,210 --> 02:43:12,740
thought-forms and it's put out by a

3418
02:43:17,380 --> 02:43:15,220
group called the sons of light

3419
02:43:19,450 --> 02:43:17,390
associated with the madam Pawlowski

3420
02:43:27,270 --> 02:43:19,460
group okay hold on for a second can you

3421
02:43:31,570 --> 02:43:29,710
okay just sounds a little funky to me

3422
02:43:38,910 --> 02:43:31,580
okay continue what was the name of the

3423
02:43:41,530 --> 02:43:38,920
book use of forms okay and it's from

3424
02:43:52,960 --> 02:43:41,540
lots of white group who are associated

3425
02:43:59,170 --> 02:43:52,970
with Madame Blavatsky able to manifest

3426
02:44:01,810 --> 02:43:59,180
in the physical reality and structured

3427
02:44:04,929 --> 02:44:01,820
with super conscious mind the

3428
02:44:06,940 --> 02:44:04,939
subconscious mind and with the emotional

3429
02:44:10,960 --> 02:44:06,950
level being able to both those thought

3430
02:44:14,830 --> 02:44:10,970
images from those were made into the

3431
02:44:16,960 --> 02:44:14,840
physical can you tweet it out can you

3432
02:44:21,071 --> 02:44:16,970
can you get the book up there on Twitter

3433
02:44:26,831 --> 02:44:23,021
don't the collective I can see if I can

3434
02:44:33,911 --> 02:44:26,841
find it on Amazon and it was called a

3435
02:44:34,991 --> 02:44:33,921
magical book of of thought forms I got

3436
02:44:42,701 --> 02:44:35,001
it I got it

3437
02:44:52,441 --> 02:44:42,711
what was it written I think 1995 and but

3438
02:44:57,930 --> 02:44:55,571
Society similar to the Rosicrucians okay

3439
02:45:01,271 --> 02:44:57,940
I got you I'm looking at the book here a

3440
02:45:05,591 --> 02:45:01,281
proven system of mental and spiritual

3441
02:45:07,481 --> 02:45:05,601
empowerment okay all right I'll get it

3442
02:45:09,970 --> 02:45:07,491
up there and Twitter and I'll check it

3443
02:45:17,671 --> 02:45:09,980
out myself and get the book that looks

3444
02:45:22,541 --> 02:45:17,681
like a good read they were talking about

3445
02:45:25,781 --> 02:45:22,551
vigils and that is something that people

3446
02:45:28,180 --> 02:45:25,791
really do need to be careful with if you

3447
02:45:33,161 --> 02:45:28,190
if you've studied any of the Kabbalistic

3448
02:45:38,911 --> 02:45:33,171
literature you're breaking up I can

3449
02:45:43,801 --> 02:45:41,321
so your warning they're warning

3450
02:45:47,741 --> 02:45:43,811
everybody about sigils to be careful

3451
02:45:50,350 --> 02:45:47,751
right basically need to do a fair amount

3452
02:45:53,411 --> 02:45:50,360
of studying before going into the whole

3453
02:45:56,321 --> 02:45:53,421
social thing because a lot of the

3454
02:45:58,451 --> 02:45:56,331
letters that are used to create the

3455
02:46:02,921 --> 02:45:58,461
vigils and to like the Kabbalistic lore

3456
02:46:05,081 --> 02:46:02,931
or indicate was so for our energy forces

3457
02:46:07,241 --> 02:46:05,091
of creation yeah well there was that

3458
02:46:10,171 --> 02:46:07,251
part but there's also creating your own

3459
02:46:16,571 --> 02:46:10,181
sigil like a dollar sign or a heart

3460
02:46:22,810 --> 02:46:16,581
right right and yeah and over on Joshua

3461
02:46:25,180 --> 02:46:22,820
P Warren if you go to his website he's

3462
02:46:27,941 --> 02:46:25,190
got some sigils there that you can

3463
02:46:29,890 --> 02:46:27,951
download and print out that mean

3464
02:46:35,970 --> 02:46:29,900
different things and

3465
02:46:38,711 --> 02:46:35,980
I did I did as a matter of fact for

3466
02:46:42,490 --> 02:46:38,721
probably for a couple of weeks I used

3467
02:46:45,730 --> 02:46:42,500
one of them as a screensaver right it

3468
02:46:49,060 --> 02:46:45,740
was my it was my wallpaper

3469
02:46:51,730 --> 02:46:49,070
and and I did I printed out a couple of

3470
02:46:54,450 --> 02:46:51,740
them and and that's all I'm gonna say

3471
02:46:57,371 --> 02:46:54,460
I'm not gonna say which ones or why or

3472
02:47:00,461 --> 02:46:57,381
if they worked or not that's not even

3473
02:47:02,081 --> 02:47:00,471
the point but it is fun to do and at

3474
02:47:04,720 --> 02:47:02,091
least you're in a little bit of a safe

3475
02:47:09,070 --> 02:47:04,730
zone I'm totally with you just like

3476
02:47:10,900 --> 02:47:09,080
anything else in this strange world that

3477
02:47:12,610 --> 02:47:10,910
that we're and if you don't know

3478
02:47:14,440 --> 02:47:12,620
anything about it don't mess with it if

3479
02:47:16,301 --> 02:47:14,450
you don't know what you're doing you

3480
02:47:17,950 --> 02:47:16,311
know don't play around and I think

3481
02:47:20,140 --> 02:47:17,960
that's always the best thing like a

3482
02:47:22,541 --> 02:47:20,150
Ouija board right doesn't don't play

3483
02:47:30,371 --> 02:47:22,551
around say thank you for the phone call

3484
02:47:37,541 --> 02:47:35,740
that's Karen Dallman absolutely okay no

3485
02:47:40,421 --> 02:47:37,551
I had so much fun doing it

3486
02:47:44,470 --> 02:47:40,431
so what we'll do that again real soon

3487
02:47:49,841 --> 02:47:44,480
thank you so much okay have a great

3488
02:47:51,461 --> 02:47:49,851
weekend and the the the dream on Mars I

3489
02:47:53,560 --> 02:47:51,471
ended up getting a little bit more

3490
02:47:56,740 --> 02:47:53,570
detail on that too as well I'll share

3491
02:48:02,980 --> 02:47:56,750
that with you at a later date hi you're

3492
02:48:07,650 --> 02:48:02,990
live on fade to black area code 602 hey

3493
02:48:16,270 --> 02:48:12,910
there you go how are you how are you how

3494
02:48:18,341 --> 02:48:16,280
are you I'm doing good so I've been

3495
02:48:21,850 --> 02:48:18,351
checking out your post and I did

3496
02:48:24,011 --> 02:48:21,860
actually I never do this but I did go

3497
02:48:30,301 --> 02:48:24,021
and listen to a piece of our interview

3498
02:48:35,261 --> 02:48:30,311
together III did it out of curiosity

3499
02:48:37,180 --> 02:48:35,271
because it was a crazy day but the thing

3500
02:48:39,581 --> 02:48:37,190
is you know I'm talking about what was

3501
02:48:40,639 --> 02:48:39,591
going on around us I remember having the

3502
02:48:43,069 --> 02:48:40,649
most

3503
02:48:46,279 --> 02:48:43,079
the funnest conversation with you but to

3504
02:48:50,059 --> 02:48:46,289
be I can't listen to myself I can't do

3505
02:48:51,590 --> 02:48:50,069
it yeah I'm only good for about it was I

3506
02:48:53,809 --> 02:48:51,600
thought you're so personable it was

3507
02:48:58,000 --> 02:48:53,819
great it was a lot of fun you know what

3508
02:49:02,649 --> 02:48:58,010
I do remember about it I remember people

3509
02:49:06,170 --> 02:49:02,659
stopping it and listening to us right

3510
02:49:08,540 --> 02:49:06,180
and yeah and that I do so I thought well

3511
02:49:10,340 --> 02:49:08,550
you know what Natasha is pretty good and

3512
02:49:17,689 --> 02:49:10,350
we're having a good time here so much so

3513
02:49:20,870 --> 02:49:17,699
that we're holding their interest how's

3514
02:49:23,809 --> 02:49:20,880
the show going how are you doing I'm

3515
02:49:26,750 --> 02:49:23,819
doing well the show is going well I I

3516
02:49:28,099 --> 02:49:26,760
didn't call to promote my show I called

3517
02:49:30,920 --> 02:49:28,109
because I was watching I thought you

3518
02:49:33,710 --> 02:49:30,930
have to reach show tonight and I wanted

3519
02:49:38,330 --> 02:49:33,720
to kind of throw my idea in the ring

3520
02:49:41,439 --> 02:49:38,340
that I submit that Buddhist monks and

3521
02:49:44,659 --> 02:49:41,449
people who have done years of meditation

3522
02:49:47,109 --> 02:49:44,669
these people are kind of messing with

3523
02:49:51,159 --> 02:49:47,119
that quantum entanglement in terms of

3524
02:49:54,380 --> 02:49:51,169
marriage between consciousness and

3525
02:49:56,330 --> 02:49:54,390
science and and and that exploration of

3526
02:50:00,109 --> 02:49:56,340
that realm through consciousness I would

3527
02:50:02,000 --> 02:50:00,119
say some high-level Buddhist monks have

3528
02:50:06,170 --> 02:50:02,010
a bead on that what do you think about

3529
02:50:08,179 --> 02:50:06,180
no question about it not I mean

3530
02:50:12,639 --> 02:50:08,189
absolutely no question about it

3531
02:50:17,359 --> 02:50:12,649
and if you think about when you go

3532
02:50:19,880 --> 02:50:17,369
anywhere with those traditions not only

3533
02:50:22,729 --> 02:50:19,890
with Buddhist monks but let's talk about

3534
02:50:25,489 --> 02:50:22,739
the Himalayas and what's going on up in

3535
02:50:29,029 --> 02:50:25,499
Tibet right where these traditions go

3536
02:50:33,439 --> 02:50:29,039
back a long long ways and they have

3537
02:50:36,769 --> 02:50:33,449
tapped into something they they may not

3538
02:50:39,559 --> 02:50:36,779
even know what it is right at the

3539
02:50:40,880 --> 02:50:39,569
quantum level but there is absolutely

3540
02:50:42,739 --> 02:50:40,890
something going on there

3541
02:50:43,880 --> 02:50:42,749
there's no question about it you know

3542
02:50:46,849 --> 02:50:43,890
what there was something else though

3543
02:50:50,989 --> 02:50:46,859
that Dean said that I wanted to go back

3544
02:50:53,461 --> 02:50:50,999
in visit where where he said that James

3545
02:50:57,390 --> 02:50:53,471
Randi would only accept levitate

3546
02:50:59,161 --> 02:50:57,400
right as evidence and and I thought that

3547
02:51:01,171 --> 02:50:59,171
that was pretty interesting because I

3548
02:51:02,730 --> 02:51:01,181
wanted to go back and look at some of

3549
02:51:05,520 --> 02:51:02,740
the other traditions that have been

3550
02:51:08,700 --> 02:51:05,530
going on in different cultures around

3551
02:51:12,661 --> 02:51:08,710
the world that dealt with just that with

3552
02:51:15,230 --> 02:51:12,671
levitation and yeah the the levitation

3553
02:51:20,940 --> 02:51:15,240
that we're talking about here may only

3554
02:51:23,850 --> 02:51:20,950
be very short but that there is

3555
02:51:26,940 --> 02:51:23,860
something going on there at the quantum

3556
02:51:32,341 --> 02:51:26,950
level that they are affecting a whole

3557
02:51:34,020 --> 02:51:32,351
lot of small things very slightly yes

3558
02:51:37,261 --> 02:51:34,030
right do you understand what I'm trying

3559
02:51:39,331 --> 02:51:37,271
to say correct yeah and I think that

3560
02:51:42,360 --> 02:51:39,341
adds to the idea of group consciousness

3561
02:51:45,600 --> 02:51:42,370
and group efforts it's something like

3562
02:51:50,700 --> 02:51:45,610
that where you can magnify that energy

3563
02:51:55,110 --> 02:51:50,710
and that effect mass meditation it so

3564
02:51:59,131 --> 02:51:55,120
that's a wonder to see this is the thing

3565
02:52:01,261 --> 02:51:59,141
Natasha I don't I don't have questions

3566
02:52:03,720 --> 02:52:01,271
right I don't write stuff out I don't

3567
02:52:06,450 --> 02:52:03,730
make notes I just flow through the show

3568
02:52:08,070 --> 02:52:06,460
and I know my my guest in the subject

3569
02:52:11,310 --> 02:52:08,080
and I like to have fun with that I don't

3570
02:52:13,171 --> 02:52:11,320
like to be constrained with trying to

3571
02:52:15,600 --> 02:52:13,181
ask a question or trying to get to a

3572
02:52:18,150 --> 02:52:15,610
thought but that was something else that

3573
02:52:21,240 --> 02:52:18,160
I wanted to ask Dean about was mass

3574
02:52:26,180 --> 02:52:21,250
meditation and and what is going on with

3575
02:52:31,770 --> 02:52:28,591
something is happening there because we

3576
02:52:33,150 --> 02:52:31,780
can see everything changed crime levels

3577
02:52:35,430 --> 02:52:33,160
drop people are calm

3578
02:52:38,730 --> 02:52:35,440
you know things things happen

3579
02:52:40,610 --> 02:52:38,740
instantaneously and what does he think

3580
02:52:43,200 --> 02:52:40,620
is going on there there must be a way to

3581
02:52:47,161 --> 02:52:43,210
to scientifically test it don't you

3582
02:52:48,780 --> 02:52:47,171
think absolutely I would say a clue in

3583
02:52:51,121 --> 02:52:48,790
that direction would be biofeedback

3584
02:52:53,011 --> 02:52:51,131
where people have learned to control

3585
02:52:55,740 --> 02:52:53,021
their heartbeat and blood pressure and

3586
02:52:57,661 --> 02:52:55,750
other physiological responses through

3587
02:52:59,970 --> 02:52:57,671
consciousness well and he brings up

3588
02:53:02,640 --> 02:52:59,980
random number generators that's one

3589
02:53:06,930 --> 02:53:02,650
thing but what about internet search

3590
02:53:10,620 --> 02:53:06,940
terms right or Internet traffic

3591
02:53:13,110 --> 02:53:10,630
or you know ice spikes of Internet

3592
02:53:16,801 --> 02:53:13,120
traffic because of consciousness and

3593
02:53:18,900 --> 02:53:16,811
font of course and you know I've even

3594
02:53:21,841 --> 02:53:18,910
thought about that in terms of Super

3595
02:53:24,930 --> 02:53:21,851
Bowl imagine a whole arena full of

3596
02:53:26,490 --> 02:53:24,940
people focusing on these players and and

3597
02:53:28,160 --> 02:53:26,500
all these people want these different

3598
02:53:31,140 --> 02:53:28,170
outcomes but there's only one of two

3599
02:53:33,150 --> 02:53:31,150
outcomes possible one team is going to

3600
02:53:34,740 --> 02:53:33,160
win one team is going to lose and you

3601
02:53:37,051 --> 02:53:34,750
have all of these people with their

3602
02:53:39,900 --> 02:53:37,061
focused attention on the performance of

3603
02:53:41,160 --> 02:53:39,910
these athletes you know I mean if you're

3604
02:53:43,051 --> 02:53:41,170
going to push the boundaries of this

3605
02:53:47,490 --> 02:53:43,061
kind of thought it could even come down

3606
02:53:50,610 --> 02:53:47,500
to things like that but I think that

3607
02:53:56,310 --> 02:53:50,620
this ties in on a deeper level with EDPs

3608
02:53:58,620 --> 02:53:56,320
and the long history of for lack of a

3609
02:54:00,810 --> 02:53:58,630
better term disembodied entities or

3610
02:54:02,551 --> 02:54:00,820
strange phenomena affecting telephone

3611
02:54:05,220 --> 02:54:02,561
service telephone calls

3612
02:54:07,320 --> 02:54:05,230
there have been EVPs people left some

3613
02:54:10,410 --> 02:54:07,330
you know phone messages from people who

3614
02:54:12,120 --> 02:54:10,420
had been deceased and there's a long

3615
02:54:16,530 --> 02:54:12,130
history of this interaction between

3616
02:54:20,700 --> 02:54:16,540
electronic equipment and these other

3617
02:54:24,631 --> 02:54:20,710
realms other dimensions perhaps might be

3618
02:54:25,381 --> 02:54:24,641
a better term of our universe and I just

3619
02:54:27,091 --> 02:54:25,391
think that we live in a

3620
02:54:29,100 --> 02:54:27,101
multi-dimensional universe and this

3621
02:54:30,900 --> 02:54:29,110
stuff kind of bleeds through from

3622
02:54:33,990 --> 02:54:30,910
dimension to dimension and I think one

3623
02:54:36,990 --> 02:54:34,000
day science will figure it out and I

3624
02:54:39,511 --> 02:54:37,000
think they'll explain it through science

3625
02:54:41,310 --> 02:54:39,521
ultimately but I think that they're

3626
02:54:43,860 --> 02:54:41,320
going to find that the ultimate tool of

3627
02:54:48,870 --> 02:54:43,870
exploration for science is consciousness

3628
02:54:52,200 --> 02:54:48,880
that direct experience will one day be

3629
02:54:54,660 --> 02:54:52,210
accepted as evidence or proof of

3630
02:54:59,700 --> 02:54:54,670
different principles now wait a minute

3631
02:55:05,280 --> 02:54:59,710
here if I got a phone call from the

3632
02:55:07,110 --> 02:55:05,290
other side I think I'm kind of freaked

3633
02:55:10,171 --> 02:55:07,120
out I mean that almost sounds scary

3634
02:55:11,461 --> 02:55:10,181
especially on the the time of day you

3635
02:55:14,520 --> 02:55:11,471
know you get that at two o'clock in the

3636
02:55:15,510 --> 02:55:14,530
morning in a dark room right I'm not so

3637
02:55:23,550 --> 02:55:15,520
sure

3638
02:55:26,160 --> 02:55:23,560
if if are you okay with that well I

3639
02:55:33,109 --> 02:55:26,170
don't know about okay I find it

3640
02:55:35,519 --> 02:55:33,119
intellectually interesting worse are

3641
02:55:38,580 --> 02:55:35,529
emotional responses to some of these

3642
02:55:40,920 --> 02:55:38,590
things that use our intellect and and

3643
02:55:42,809 --> 02:55:40,930
kind of turn the coin around and look at

3644
02:55:46,319 --> 02:55:42,819
the other side look at it you know kind

3645
02:55:50,580 --> 02:55:46,329
of backwards and because you know we're

3646
02:55:53,700 --> 02:55:50,590
wired to respond to strange phenomena

3647
02:55:56,040 --> 02:55:53,710
with fear or repulsion because that's

3648
02:55:58,830 --> 02:55:56,050
what kept us safe right and allowed us

3649
02:56:03,389 --> 02:55:58,840
to you know survive so that's a given

3650
02:56:06,120 --> 02:56:03,399
but you know I'm you know the

3651
02:56:06,389 --> 02:56:06,130
intellectual side for me I'm cool with

3652
02:56:09,529 --> 02:56:06,399
that

3653
02:56:15,630 --> 02:56:09,539
yeah I just don't want to be the the

3654
02:56:17,910 --> 02:56:15,640
participant in the experiment I got a I

3655
02:56:20,790 --> 02:56:17,920
got a I got to wrap the show but where

3656
02:56:24,599 --> 02:56:20,800
can everybody go and listen to you and

3657
02:56:27,059 --> 02:56:24,609
find your stuff you can go to my youtube

3658
02:56:30,540 --> 02:56:27,069
channel which is mysterious forces live

3659
02:56:34,710 --> 02:56:30,550
and I have a candid interview with you

3660
02:56:37,050 --> 02:56:34,720
that was audio only Richard Dolan some

3661
02:56:39,540 --> 02:56:37,060
other folks the show's evolving so

3662
02:56:42,420 --> 02:56:39,550
that's the main hub and you can find me

3663
02:56:45,870 --> 02:56:42,430
on Facebook at mysterious forces live

3664
02:56:48,269 --> 02:56:45,880
and on Twitter it's at my forces lives

3665
02:56:49,679 --> 02:56:48,279
thank you so much Jimmy I appreciate you

3666
02:56:52,200 --> 02:56:49,689
letting me plug my show I really

3667
02:56:53,700 --> 02:56:52,210
appreciate no it's my pleasure and what

3668
02:56:57,479 --> 02:56:53,710
about Twitter where were you at on

3669
02:57:01,229 --> 02:56:57,489
twitter twitter mysterious forces live

3670
02:57:06,240 --> 02:57:01,239
and then contact me is at my forces

3671
02:57:10,019 --> 02:57:06,250
lives I had I was just looking for my

3672
02:57:11,760 --> 02:57:10,029
audio drop for you and I can't find it I

3673
02:57:17,819 --> 02:57:11,770
was that I was gonna play it right now

3674
02:57:19,950 --> 02:57:17,829
all right we'll do it next time you know

3675
02:57:22,979 --> 02:57:19,960
what it was a great week too as well but

3676
02:57:24,710 --> 02:57:22,989
you know it's I'm so happy that she

3677
02:57:27,269 --> 02:57:24,720
called in it's about time

3678
02:57:29,099 --> 02:57:27,279
great thank you so much I'll talk to you

3679
02:57:29,519 --> 02:57:29,109
soon and come on my show please come on

3680
02:57:31,979 --> 02:57:29,529
mice

3681
02:57:37,110 --> 02:57:31,989
I was just on your show now you need to

3682
02:57:39,269 --> 02:57:37,120
come on I do a live stream broadcast ok

3683
02:57:40,650 --> 02:57:39,279
it's only 30 minutes only 30 minutes of

3684
02:57:43,740 --> 02:57:40,660
your time there you go

3685
02:57:45,450 --> 02:57:43,750
I'll do it anytime you need me all right

3686
02:57:48,719 --> 02:57:45,460
awesome Jimmy have a good night and have

3687
02:57:51,570 --> 02:57:48,729
a good weekend Thank You Natasha again

3688
02:57:54,570 --> 02:57:51,580
thank you so much oh you're welcome

3689
02:57:57,210 --> 02:57:54,580
thank you sir have a good night good

3690
02:58:01,910 --> 02:57:57,220
night you know I'm gonna I just want to

3691
02:58:04,559 --> 02:58:01,920
say we were at contact in the desert and

3692
02:58:06,240 --> 02:58:04,569
Natasha invited me over you know for an

3693
02:58:10,650 --> 02:58:06,250
interview we went around the corner had

3694
02:58:12,269 --> 02:58:10,660
the most amazing setup now so here you

3695
02:58:13,920 --> 02:58:12,279
know fade to black right you know when

3696
02:58:16,800 --> 02:58:13,930
we show up out there and we're doing our

3697
02:58:19,740 --> 02:58:16,810
live show and we've got a I walk around

3698
02:58:24,510 --> 02:58:19,750
the corner and Natasha had the studio

3699
02:58:29,490 --> 02:58:24,520
set up of doom digital console re 20

3700
02:58:32,190 --> 02:58:29,500
microphones headphone amps set up and

3701
02:58:36,840 --> 02:58:32,200
I'm like what's going on here look at

3702
02:58:39,660 --> 02:58:36,850
you absolutely a professional and so

3703
02:58:41,639 --> 02:58:39,670
everybody go and check it out mysterious

3704
02:58:44,099 --> 02:58:41,649
forces live I got to get out of here

3705
02:58:48,120 --> 02:58:44,109
we're gonna go and find us a taco truck

3706
02:58:51,210 --> 02:58:48,130
and start our weekend so everybody out

3707
02:58:54,330 --> 02:58:51,220
there just have a great safe awesome fun

3708
02:58:56,790 --> 02:58:54,340
weekend the week that we had here on

3709
02:58:59,010 --> 02:58:56,800
fader block was incredible what we've

3710
02:58:59,580 --> 02:58:59,020
got happening for everybody else next

3711
02:59:02,340 --> 02:58:59,590
week

3712
02:59:04,830 --> 02:59:02,350
just wait till Monday and I'm not joking

3713
02:59:07,440 --> 02:59:04,840
betablox executive producer triticum

3714
02:59:10,170 --> 02:59:07,450
Murray on shows produced by Hill J palm

3715
02:59:12,990 --> 02:59:10,180
Renee Dennis and Bob announces our Steve

3716
02:59:15,690 --> 02:59:13,000
Hart or gene Vitello mark D Kivar what

3717
02:59:16,591 --> 02:59:15,700
master is drew the geek music doug

3718
02:59:20,450 --> 02:59:16,601
aldrich

3719
02:59:23,461 --> 02:59:20,460
intro space boys space boy music.com

3720
02:59:25,200 --> 02:59:23,471
beta black is produced by kjsurya for

3721
02:59:30,030 --> 02:59:25,210
the GameChanger network and syndication

3722
02:59:32,280 --> 02:59:30,040
is K GRA the planet broadcast on a

3723
02:59:33,631 --> 02:59:32,290
copyright of 2018 by fade to black in

3724
02:59:36,060 --> 02:59:33,641
the game-changer Network

3725
02:59:37,921 --> 02:59:36,070
it could not be rebroadcast downloaded

3726
02:59:40,680 --> 02:59:37,931
copied or used anywhere in the known

3727
02:59:42,110 --> 02:59:40,690
universe without written permission from

3728
02:59:45,211 --> 02:59:42,120
fade to black for the GameChanger

3729
02:59:48,390 --> 02:59:45,221
network that's it that's another week

3730
02:59:51,810 --> 02:59:48,400
down for fade to black we're gonna go

3731
02:59:55,490 --> 02:59:51,820
start our weekend right now we'll see on

3732
02:59:58,590 --> 02:59:55,500
Monday until then everybody be saved go

3733
03:00:12,910 --> 02:59:58,600
back legs happy